Difference between revisions of "User talk:Xymph"

Latest revision as of 07:18, 15 April 2024

1 Archived discussions
2 Hexen Mac demo maps
3 Yet another bot suggestion
4 Doomwiki edit limit faux pas
5 Skeleton WAD pages
6 Vrack2BiggestEver... isn't the BiggestEver anymore?
7 DSDA Tables for main WAD pages
8 Hadephobia's original soundtrack
9 Pain chance percentage values
10 Dating the wad
11 Bot problem
12 Speedy delete vs unused images
13 Titlepic upscaling
14 "use local wl for Bethesda, fix grammar"
15 Changing the year of release for DMP series
16 Pyroscourge's name
17 Episode or multilevel WAD
18 DBP mapper page edits
19 Date of release
20 Nicknames
21 myhouse
22 Column gap
23 Soulcrusher
24 Cacowards links
25 Two questions about redirects
26 deleting my wiki page?
27 Wad template usage
28 Removing wikilinks for author of Voxel Doom
29 Heretic pre-release screenshots
30 Name change
31 Thing counting on maps
32 Freedoom Phase 2 music
33 Categorization
34 Article deletion
35 Episode replacement
36 Heretic HUD Face
37 Possibly new glitch?
38 WADCAT full name
39 Pyroscourge/Pieruskwurje
40 Code tags
41 Unreviewed redirects
42 Trouble with redirects' anchors
43 Notability, self-promotion and redlinks
44 Sorry!
45 Mapper stub
46 Doom Power

Archived discussions[edit]

2016 | 2017-2018 | 2019-2021

Hexen Mac demo maps[edit]

Maps 1 and 4 are fully functional in the program they're made for, but not anything else I know of. I can try and record a video if necessary. - SiFi270 (talk) 10:30, 31 December 2021 (CST)

That doesn't seem supported by the reference linked: "A lot of lumps are far too small (4 bytes or less) to actually contain anything useful. MAP01 and MAP04 are made unplayable this way." I interpreted that as the lumps belonging to those two MAPs themselves being too small to be meaningful. If they are, in fact, proper maps playable only in the Mac demo itself, then the wording should make that clearer (I modified your edit because it wasn't clear enough, to me anyway). --Xymph (talk) 10:42, 31 December 2021 (CST)

I honestly have no recollection of what I did or didn't do back then. It's certainly possible the code I used to extract stuff was flawed and failed on these two maps. --Gez (talk) 05:42, 9 January 2022 (CST)

Could you re-check and update the relevant section if necessary? I don't have time for this, nor the tooling. --Xymph (talk) 06:12, 9 January 2022 (CST)

Yet another bot suggestion[edit]

Would it be feasible to automatically look at a wad's Soundtrack section, and then edit accordingly the and uses the music track " " part of the corresponding map's skeleton? There's certainly a fair few cases to take into account (e.g. if it starts with "MIDI version of <blah>" proper grammar would require a formulation like "and uses as music track a MIDI version of <blah>") and I'm sure there's gonna be several caveats discovered due to the lack of complete consistency in these sections. Also things like REKKR or BTSX may cause confusions due to having several identical map lumps. But since generally soundtrack information focuses on a wad's main page and forgets about the map pages, that could, if possible, cut down on tedious busy work to copy-paste information from one page to another. --Gez (talk) 05:42, 9 January 2022 (CST),.

Have pondered that a few times over the years, but "the lack of complete consistency" is exactly why I see this as unfeasible. Not just the variety of formatting styles but also the links (internal and to Wikipedia, both game titles and music artists/songs) that would need to be processed, make it an insurmountable task for me. And time-wise that doesn't even take my ballooning to-do list into account, both in covering the recent flood of new WADs and custom things lists for existing ones, as well as the DSDA demos tables still to be updated for many dozens of megawads (and then cleaning remnant linking to old DSDA). I'm longing for the summer doldrums already. ;-) --Xymph (talk) 05:54, 9 January 2022 (CST)

Fair enough. Alternative suggestion: have the map skeleton be something like and uses the [[Adding custom music|music]] track "[[Category:Map pages without soundtrack information]]". so that would give a handy way to check manually which map articles need to be updated. --Gez (talk) 06:59, 9 January 2022 (CST)

Good idea, added to templates for future skeletons. Updating existing articles will take some additional scripting and a very long bot run. Please create the category. --Xymph (talk) 08:01, 9 January 2022 (CST)

A few enhancements to pregreplGen.php sufficed with several hours of running time. Now your category has 4500+ entries. Enjoy. ;-) --Xymph (talk) 16:31, 11 January 2022 (CST)

Doomwiki edit limit faux pas[edit]

Hy Xymph! First of all, thank you a lot for checking over my recent edits and all the work you've done for this community. I'm a big fan of what you do. Second, I was wondering if there's any unwritten rule about how many edits should an user do per day? I realize that I made quite a few edits in the last 24 hours and then realized that all those edits would have to be reviewed/verified by an editor with permissions, in this case it was you, so I'm a bit embarrassed at the thought of having to prompt so many reviews and take the time of somebody else. So I was wondering if there is a suggested limit of edits? Any recommendations? Thanks, mate. Endless01 (talk) 04:26, 1 February 2022 (CST)

Thanks for the kind words. There is no rule/guideline about edit limits, and if there were, others already broke it in recent months. ;-) Fortunately a few other people also do reviews, but it is considerate of you to raise this topic. If you'd like to take one factor into account, you could take it easy on days that Recent Changes is already very busy with contributions by others, and do more on slow(er) days. --Xymph (talk) 06:30, 1 February 2022 (CST)

Happy to hear that then! I'll try to do a handful of edits during the weekdays, and see if I can work more during weekends. Happy to help out filling map stubs and making some other articles :D Endless01 (talk) 16:56, 1 February 2022 (CST)

You have been doing great work so far, thanks a lot for the time you're putting in this, and I look forward to more of your contributions :) --Dynamo128 (talk) 17:30, 1 February 2022 (CST)

Skeleton WAD pages[edit]

Hi mate! I've been creating some pages for single-level WADs and I was wondering if creating the skeletons as a initial step is the right way? Since I know there's some bots that take care of more technical stuff, I wasn't sure what was needed to be filled. Also, am I having the greatest deja vu ever but I could've swear I created the Dystopia Level page, but now it shows it was originally created in 2019? Did I miss something or am I going crazy? haha. - Endless01 (talk) 03:05, 15 February 2022 (CST)

There is only one active bot account at this time, which is mainly used for map series, not much for single-level WADs. Skeletons are generated by DMMPST so if you put in all the sections I may have to delete some stuff that doesn't apply (like the DM section here) and add all the stats etc. So you might as well create single-level articles with just the intro & links sections and wad template, then I'll paste in all the intermediate sections.

Dystopia Level was a duplicate; initially I quickly deleted it, then changed my mind and added a redirect to the existing page Dystopia. --Xymph (talk) 03:19, 15 February 2022 (CST)

Ah, I see! My bad then. I thought I searched the page to see if it was already done but I might have confused it. Next single-level PWAD page I create, I'll follow your instructions. I want to try and fill the gap that Doomer96 left. The work done by Doomer96 is is remarkable and I hope to help out as much, someday. Thanks a lot, as usual! :D - Endless01 (talk) 03:29, 15 February 2022 (CST)

Well, personally I thought the notability of the some of the WAD articles created by Doomer96 was questionable, but a lot of ground was covered indeed. And Doomer96 indeed used DMMPST to post complete skeletons with all the data, so it left less touch-up work for me (often only the map view), which was welcome. --Xymph (talk) 03:51, 15 February 2022 (CST)

Only responding now since I was out of town for a month or so, but in my absolutely humble, biased, and completely non-authoritative opinion, to "fill the gap that Doomer96 left" I say: yes please! :D --Dynamo128 (talk) 01:59, 7 March 2022 (CST)

Vrack2BiggestEver... isn't the BiggestEver anymore?[edit]

Hiya Xymph, I saw your DMMPST output for Vrack2BiggestEver - A test map of 5x Vrack2 combined into one. Well, from the same site, there is now a 2018 contender for VRack2BiggestEver as VRack2SuperHuge. It clocks in at 9.4 MB, compared to BiggestEver's 3.9 MB. Its also hosted by the Deep site. So if you want to hazard your luck for a test case, here it is - http://www.sbsoftware.com/files/vrack2-superhuge.zip --Redneckerz (talk) 12:01, 18 February 2022 (CST)

Oh, I wasn't, but... test passed. :) --Xymph (talk) 12:21, 18 February 2022 (CST)

Much appreciated. I am almost disappointed it didn't do a dent to your utility :) But its good to have these results in and SuperHuge seems like some idiotic overkill :) Thanks for covering this. --Redneckerz (talk) 12:27, 18 February 2022 (CST)

DSDA Tables for main WAD pages[edit]

Xymph, I noticed that the bot is automatically updating DSDA tables for maps now. Do you think it's possible to get it to pull the D2ALL and Episode times and drop those into a table on the main WAD page as well? I'm not sure if this was already discussed or mentioned at all, or even how feasible it would be. Turbine2k6 (talk) 10:23, 20 February 2022 (CST)

Already brought up (and on my to-do list before that), but with the workload generated for me in recent months by Dynamo, Matador, Endless and others, I have no idea if/when I'll get around to it... --Xymph (talk) 14:34, 20 February 2022 (CST)

I feel called out lol ): should I slow down my wiki output? - Endless01 (talk) 17:58, 20 February 2022 (CST)

It's not just you, WAD additions have been coming in full throttle most of the time since October, and it's wearing me out a bit. Only the latter half of November was quieter, allowing me to develop the DSDA map records script. That was when the redlinks count dipped below 1900, but this year it's never been below 2000 anymore. Partly due to DUMP2/3 and RAMP which added 348 map links just between them, and which I'm back-burnering because large mixed format WADs are too elaborate and time-consuming to handle until Omgifol supports UDMF (of which initial development was recently resumed by Revenant). But I'm trying to keep up with all the other newly added WADs, there are not many other editors actively reviewing all contributions either, and all that just leaves little time/energy for scripting (apart from small stuff really needed asap).

The wiki is a collaborative effort and a single editor shouldn't be a bottleneck, but for scripting I guess I am. So yeah, slowing down WAD additions until the backlog is cleared would increase the chance that major scripting projects happen sooner than later. --Xymph (talk) 09:33, 21 February 2022 (CST)

Hadephobia's original soundtrack[edit]

Hi Xymph! Concerning Hadephobia's soundtrack, musics by PRIMEVAL and Jimmy were made specifically for this project. Should be sufficient for adding the "PWADs with original soundtrack" category ? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Pierrot (talk • contribs) .

Must admit I didn't fully check the track count and credits, I just saw a whole bunch of non-original entries. 9-10 out of 35 still doesn't seem like a whole "soundtrack" to me, but now that I look at the category description, it turns out at least one song is all that is required. So, cat re-applied. --Xymph (talk) 16:29, 31 March 2022 (CDT)

Pain chance percentage values[edit]

Hi, right now I am reading https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Pain_state that you directed me to after my edit revision, and it blew my mind! Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 31.60.37.116 (talk)

You're welcome. --Xymph (talk) 02:36, 27 April 2022 (CDT)

Dating the wad[edit]

Hi, I noticed you moved Modest Mapping II into 2021 on my page. What is the policy to date the wads in general? Because I went with idgame upload date and it was yesterday or so. Probably not something that will come up very often, but who knows. --ViolentBeetle (talk) 13:41, 19 July 2022 (CDT)

I believe (without looking for sources) that long ago, the idgames upload was indeed considered the release date, and the trigger to start wiki coverage. But in recent years, so many WADs were released in beta or RC in the forums, and added to the wiki with the forums date, that the line has blurred. In particular because such WADs were occasionally Cacowarded before the idgames upload, or lingered in the forums without ever getting uploaded.

So when an RC gets covered on the wiki by someone, as was the case for MM2 (on less than half, not all associated mapper articles), with the forums date, I just use that for consistency. But the more convoluted a mod's release history, the more approximate that entry is going to be, I suppose. --Xymph (talk) 14:19, 19 July 2022 (CDT)

Bot problem[edit]

I noticed an apparent false positive edit by XymphBot, here, which was obvious as the page is not meant to be edited at all. If you can ensure this case gets ignored in the future I will revert it at that point. Appears the intent was to be editing wikilinks but apparently it also somehow matched this text in the middle of a pre-formatted block. --Quasar (talk) 00:50, 27 August 2022 (CDT)

pregreplGen.php doesn't know about pre-formatted blocks or pristine pages, it's a simple search & replace script, prompting me to confirm each change. I recall hesitating at the FAQ but didn't think much of it. Evidently thought wrong/too little. :) Reverted, and since there's nothing autonomous about XymphBot, it won't happen again. --Xymph (talk) 02:52, 27 August 2022 (CDT)

Alright thanks. --Quasar (talk) 11:28, 27 August 2022 (CDT)

Speedy delete vs unused images[edit]

As far as I'm aware unused image deletion isn't actually covered under any of the speedy delete criteria. Criteria 15 is specifically to allow for maintenance tasks like category and article (especially redirect) moves which do not result in any meaningful difference in site content. However it's going to be uncontroversial in a case like the one being referred to here and similar deletes weren't previously subjected to any prolonged discussion, so we can let it slide as far as making any unnecessary edits is concerned. --Quasar (talk) 16:01, 2 September 2022 (CDT)

True, I picked 15 because a more specific type for unused, poor quality images wasn't available, and because I indeed expected these deletes to be uncontroversial. Wasn't aware 15 is intended for more limited cases. Anyway, I already added a bunch more Hacx images to the category two days ago, so if you feel like finishing them off quickly, I have no objections. :) --Xymph (talk) 16:44, 2 September 2022 (CDT)

Titlepic upscaling[edit]

I notices that you put "scaled up to correct aspect ratio" under any titlepic you upload. I wondered whether this is historically true. Didn't Doom run correct at 320x200? I thought this was the native resolution or at least correct aspect ratio for most monitors back then.

Another thing I wanted to ask: how do you upscale your extracted titlepic lumps? Because i can see yours end up significantly smaller in size than mine. I just upscale them with paint and end up with 200-300 KB. I know this is a super beginner question but i'm curious how i can get similar small file sizes. --Gregor (talk) 19:02, 26 November 2022 (CST)

Doom ran at 320x200 but in a 4:3 aspect, not a 8:5 aspect. We have a whole article on aspect ratio; just read it. As for the proper way to rescale, do not use Paint. Personally I use Gimp, with a two-step process: first rescale to 1600x1200 with no interpolation, then scale down to 640x480 with interpolation. --Gez (talk) 07:54, 27 November 2022 (CST)

Was about to point the aspect ratio article too. As a Linux person, I naturally use a script to quickly rescale, so the efficiency is due to the GD/libpng libraries:

#!/usr/bin/php
<?php
	// rescale titlepic.png from 320x200 to 640x480
	if ($argc != 2 || !is_file($argv[1])) {
		echo "Usage: {$argv[0]} <titlepic.png>\n";
		exit(1);
	}
	$file = $argv[1];
	$file2 = str_replace('.png', '-2.png', $file);
	list($width, $height) = getimagesize($file);
	$w = 640; $h = 480;
	$src = imagecreatefrompng($file);
	$dst = imagecreatetruecolor($w, $h);
	imagecopyresampled($dst, $src, 0, 0, 0, 0, $w, $h, $width, $height);
	imagepng($dst, $file2, 9);
?>

For your File:Jumpwad title.png of 110KB, I got 48KB, and for File:Nostalgia title.png of 132KB, I got 50KB. For 800x600 in-game shots, the savings would indeed be more significant. --Xymph (talk) 08:03, 27 November 2022 (CST)

That article was an interesting read. Interesting indeed. I'm on windows, so i guess i'll try gimp and see how that changes things. Thanks for the advice to you both. --Gregor (talk) 14:13, 27 November 2022 (CST)

"use local wl for Bethesda, fix grammar"[edit]

1. That's the wrong Bethesda, there's a reason I didn't use it to begin with. Bethesda Softworks is the parent company/publisher. Bethesda Game Studios is the company that makes Fallout. The two have never been the same thing.
2. Did you not see our discussion regarding the Fallout wiki opening in 3 days (from when the post was made)? I don't think reverting all that work is worthwhile under that kind of timeframe if that's your only objection. --Quasar (talk) 11:27, 30 December 2022 (CST)

I moved/merged the thread, so... yes I read it. :) BGS is mentioned on our Bethesda Softworks article so I figured it was close enough (even considered making Bethesda Game Studios redirect to it, but now... maybe not). But I changed the sentence primarily because the old style looked like a run-on phrase (lacking a possessive apostrophe, at least). Would be okay with reverting to the wp we had before.

I didn't change any FO/related links indeed because of their wiki opening soon, and reverted only the Elder Scrolls link because it was now broken. Generally I am okay with using FO wiki links for FO topics, but am not convinced about doing that for general company links like Bethesda. Hope that addresses your concerns? --Xymph (talk) 14:59, 30 December 2022 (CST)

I don't consider our Bethesda article to be about BGS or sufficient for its coverage. Nor should it be made so, as BGS is not even relevant to Doom. So I don't have any issue having BGS links specifically going to another wiki, and would prefer that they do so, whether it's to wp or falloutwiki. Links referring to Bethesda Softworks should stay pointing to our local Bethesda Softworks article. If someone isn't sure which is which in some context, it's no different than any other incorrect wiki link being made.

It looks like for some reason the UESP article has moved to Skyrim:Skyrim on their end. I don't even see a move in the page history so I don't know how or when that happened. --Quasar (talk) 15:22, 30 December 2022 (CST)

I reverted to wp, but only now see that the apostrophe was lost in Kid's edit. Anyway, I'll stay out of it and leave remaining edits and approvals to you. --Xymph (talk) 15:32, 30 December 2022 (CST)

Changing the year of release for DMP series[edit]

Hello! I am now in the process of cleaning Doomworld Mega Project articles and one big thing that I see is that most of this articles have wrong year of release listed. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the release date is the date when the first version of the wad was released somewhere (at DW forums for example) even if it is a beta version. If so, could you please use your bot to move maps and wads in individual pages for participants of these collaborations from one year to another? I hate to do it manually. I will notice you when I'm done. --Nockson (talk) 16:23, 18 March 2023 (CDT)

For that series, see the exception. For a better understanding of my bot account, see here. In other words, it cannot be given arbitrary instructions, it just executes API commands issued by scripts. And it's not feasible to write one for this situation, even we were to agree on changing the aforementioned release year exception. --Xymph (talk) 18:52, 18 March 2023 (CDT)

That's very strange. Is there any way to make such hidden exception a part of the rules? How should anyone became aware that such exceptions even exist before making an edit? Maybe I should open a discussion at Central Processing? Nevermind, I've created a topic at Central Processing. --Nockson (talk) 01:11, 19 March 2023 (CDT)

Pyroscourge's name[edit]

Hello! By looking through Winter's Fury 2016.5 version wad (which has a lot of development commentary) I found out Pyroscourge's real name. It is clearly shown in commentary in DECORATE and not specially hidden. The question is - can I use this info right away or should I go to Doomworld and PM them, asking permission first? I didn't find some guideline about personal data in rules, but I don't want to make people uncomfortable. --Nockson (talk) 14:22, 22 March 2023 (CDT)

If it's only buried in an old release (not even in the most recent) and not plainly documented in readme/credits files, then it seems to me it wasn't the author's intention to make their name all that public. But I suppose you could ask if they don't mind. --Xymph (talk) 15:44, 22 March 2023 (CDT)

Episode or multilevel WAD[edit]

Hello! I want to discuss this edit, not for the sake of this paricular WAD, but for my future edits. IMO "Shadows of Chronos" is an episode WAD, because it is equal to a standard Hexen episode - has a hub and 5 levels around it. I thought that multilevel WADs category is for mappacks, that have unconnected maps, like smaller DMPs (fewer levels than megawad). Or am I wrong and only Doom mods can have episode WADs? --Nockson (talk) 09:05, 8 April 2023 (CDT)

Normally the threshold of multilevel sets is up to 6 maps; 7 is close enough to 8-9 to be an episode. But I hadn't realized this is Hexen, and I suppose a hub-set can also be tagged as an episode. Btw, the map list doesn't mark which one is the hub, that would be useful information. Edit: it then makes sense if intros of the pertaining map pages mention the same info. --Xymph (talk) 10:32, 8 April 2023 (CDT)

Done! Is it okay this way? --Nockson (talk) 13:38, 8 April 2023 (CDT)

Sure. It's simply the same deal as music: WAD overview page and individual map pages should be consistent with each other. --Xymph (talk) 13:58, 8 April 2023 (CDT)

DBP mapper page edits[edit]

I'm going through and adding all the WADs first. For your own sanity, it might be best to hold off on the individual page edits until I finish and just do them all in one go. --Matador (talk) 02:14, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

See here, the bulk of WAD links are done via bot script, one path at a time. There were just a few links to the series article that needed manual massaging. Edit: pregreplGen.php saved the day here too, in all but one case. --Xymph (talk) 02:17, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

Date of release[edit]

Hi! Got another question: what time zone should be taken into account when filling in the release date of mods? GMT? --Nockson (talk) 08:59, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

No idea. It normally doesn't make that much difference anyway. --Xymph (talk) 09:07, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

Example: Matador wrote in today's DBP57: Shatter Realm article that it was released on March 1, but it is actually March 2 (03:34 GMT). Some of the DBPs have the same issue. Should I fix it or leave at that? I ask because in my two DBP pages I've used the Moscow time (GMT+3). --Nockson (talk) 09:12, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

For spelling we generally use US English due to id being an American company, but also allow Standard English in specific situations. So perhaps we can apply something similar towards time zones, i.e. if a release initially happened in USA or Europe, use that time zone. But again, I dunno... perhaps a long-standing admin can advice? --Xymph (talk) 09:28, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

Got your point. Because Doomer Boards is mostly US website I will use US time. And we also have now 56 DBP pages that all use US time. ~~Gonna fix my two articles then.~~ (edit: dates are OK) Thanks! --Nockson (talk) 09:36, 12 April 2023 (CDT)

Nicknames[edit]

Hello! Sorry, but I need to bother you again. When certain content creator has different nicknames, which of them should I put into for example a map article: 1) a direct link to their wiki page which uses another nickname; OR 2) redirect but with an actual nickname? --Nockson (talk) 15:04, 14 April 2023 (CDT)

Both are in use, particularly when someone changes alias while articles and links already exist. The main thing about WAD overviews is to use the canonical path for mappers (optionally with a different link text) so that when I create the .ini file (and from that map articles), they get the correct link and author category. Keeping mapper categories consistent and unduplicated is a PITA with all these alias changes over the years, and with inconsistent spelling/casing in project documentation. --Xymph (talk) 16:51, 14 April 2023 (CDT)

myhouse[edit]

Has the myhouse article been locked in some form? Or were my editing rights revoked?? When i rejected an edit just now, it didn't autocheck but instead added it to the list of pending review until you checked it. ----Gregor (talk) 16:22, 28 April 2023 (CDT)

Not that I'm aware of. Earlier edits had not yet been accepted, so I think you may have forgotten to tick the 'Accept this version' checkbox when doing that revert. --Xymph (talk) 16:38, 28 April 2023 (CDT)

Yeah, that was probaly it. Thanx ----Gregor (talk) 16:53, 28 April 2023 (CDT)

Column gap[edit]

What is the reason why i can't use wider gaps than 5em when it causes line wrapping? I personally think it looks very ugly to the eye when a list has a line wrap around like this. It can easily be remedied by increasing the gap a little. Doesn't look any worse on mobile either way. So why keep that flaw? Is there a technical reason for this or is it just the "standard way" of doing things (which i don't see by itself to be a good enough reason to not correct an visual flaw)? In other words: i'd like to use it this way, if it doesn't cause any issues with formatting, why can't i? ----Gregor (talk) 13:10, 3 May 2023 (CDT)

Because your PC, full-screen browser, and 21:9 monitor are not the measure of the wiki's layout. And a factor 3 increase is not "a little." Pages need to render (reasonably) well on a wide variety of screens, including landscape and portrait mobile devices and non-full-screen windows. The wide gap wastes a lot of space on narrower page layouts, causing the map and soundtrack columns to get crammed into a third of the body width with a huge white area in between. Personally I do consider that an ugly layout. The 5em gap layout was developed years ago by Quasar and has served us well since. Line wraps are common with long(er) map titles and extensive soundtrack credits, I don't mind them much, and it is more important that both columns are roughly equally long (that is why we play with the first column's width), and soundtrack rows align approximately with map names. And that alignment is also visually hampered by a very wide gap. But no matter how wide the gap and the first column, page layouts will vary somewhat across screens and devices. So, let's just stick to the standard as IMO it's the best compromise. --Xymph (talk) 15:25, 3 May 2023 (CDT)

Actually I rarely set my browser to full-screen nor do i have a 21:9 monitor... but i get your point. I still think that just because it's the default way of doing something and on most occasions also the correct one, means it has to be followed religiously for every situation. What is considered visually displeasing or ugly is of course very much a matter of personal taste. But speaking about compromise - if i do understand you correctly the first column's width can be adjusted. So in this case i would then increase the column's width to 40% to alleviate the problem. Is that ok? ----Gregor (talk) 16:25, 3 May 2023 (CDT)

Yeah, I was exaggerating. ;-) The big white gap between columns would always be a problem because it leaves less width for information. So it in fact results in more line wrapping in the soundtrack column. To reduce wrapping in the maps column, tweaking its width as always been the normal approach, not widening the gap. So yes, you can increase it a little bit, but as said the idea remains to keep both columns roughly equally high across a reasonable range of screen/window widths. --Xymph (talk) 07:07, 4 May 2023 (CDT)

Soulcrusher[edit]

Hello! I'm making articles for Caco RUps, yesterday I've made a page for Soulcrusher, which I'm currently editing. And my God, this mod is a mess. There are some levels inside the WAD that can't be reached inside the game, its MAPINFO contains levels that don't even exist, and for some reason I can't get past the cutscenes to check some of the levels (controls doesn't work). Anyway, I suggest to not make individual map pages for the mod. I surely don't have patience to check playability of all its levels. Maybe someone else could do it, but I'm not sure it is worth it. I wanna finish with its soundtrack and move on, let it stay as a stub for a while. What do you think? --Nockson (talk) 12:18, 4 May 2023 (CDT)

Works for me, then unlink the maps and we leave it at that. --Xymph (talk) 12:37, 4 May 2023 (CDT)

Cacowards links[edit]

Had a little issue today scrolling through Cacowards pages to plan my future work. A few weeks ago you reverted my edit on Caco2021, where I've updated DWF links to IG. But I see that you did the same thing via your bot HERE and HERE, for example. What's the difference? --Nockson (talk) 15:58, 4 May 2023 (CDT)

That's more like semi-automatic "collateral damage" of updating links on mapper pages - I could have skipped them but didn't <shrug>. The Cacoward pages use the links as published in the original articles, so there's no need to explicitly edit them for the sake of ig-ifying everything everywhere. I could have not reverted that edit, but just happened to do it in the spur of the moment <shrug>. --Xymph (talk) 02:02, 5 May 2023 (CDT)

Two questions about redirects[edit]

Hello! I know that these are probably minor things, but I still need to ask you two questions: 1) In the "Appearance statistics" sections for weapons, items, monsters etc you use redirects instead of proper links to maps and even IWADs ("Plutonia Experiment" and "Ultimate Doom" both without "The"). Is this intentional? 2) Overview articles for Doom II, Evilution and Plutonia uses "Level XX" phrases over the usual MAPXX links. I looked through these pages history and see that this is intentional, probably because vanilla Doom shows "Level XX" on the automap. And that's the reason why redirects with "Level XX" exist. However such redirects exist only for Doom II and a few maps from Final Doom. Should I create redirects of this type for all other Final Doom maps? Thanks in advance! --Nockson (talk) 16:35, 16 June 2023 (CDT)

1. Yes. That's how they're programmed into DMMPST. 2. Right. No, if they weren't needed early on in the wiki's life, they're not needed anymore.
General note 1: redirects are not evil, it is not essential to avoid them at extreme effort. Among other purposes like easier search results, they're a convenience tool for writing naturally flowing texts without insisting on writing [[link|text]] all the time. So you can use it, but it's okay not to use that link structure and keep the redirect. From that follows that editing articles solely to change redirects into direct links, is not functional and just clutters Recent Changes. If there's another, functional reason to edit an article and you feel like avoiding a redirect, then there's little harm, especially when changing a plural redirect into a pluralized links (e.g. rockets for rockets). But otherwise, just be more relaxed about redirects.
General note 2: empty lines below section headers are also not evil, it is not essential to avoid them at extreme effort, either. Edits like these are not functional and again just clutter Recent Changes. I didn't stop you in your tracks because to some degree I understand the desire for consistency when changing these in related articles that did get functional changes. But really, don't you have better things to do? ;-) Especially between header and prettytable (like in Data sections), an empty line makes the header stand out a bit better. And empty lines above big collapsible navboxes in page footers have a layout purpose, so should be restored. But not the others, what's done is done.
General advice: often it's better to leave well enough alone, until polishing it can be combined with an update that actually matters. --Xymph (talk) 14:46, 17 June 2023 (CDT)

deleting my wiki page?[edit]

i saw you nominated some page i made for speedy deletion. It was a sprite from the original doom which serves as a switch. Could you tell me what is wrong so i can fix it?

--Hey guys, i'm new to doom wiki and I am here to add some good wads, textures in doom, and more! I have an actual username on other places, but not here. Doom Is Eternal (talk) 14:23, 18 June 2023 (CDT)

Hi, the reason for the nomination is in the edit summary: "topic covered in switch, a specific focus on one mod is not needed". You can see the summary with the diff, in the page history, and in Recent Changes. For every wiki user, newcomers especially, it is recommended to keep an eye on Recent Changes how your contributions are reviewed and (possibly) edited, and learn from that.

Regarding your other question: your WAD fan post was not deleted but moved to your user area as a sandbox for possible further editing. This move was also logged in Recent Changes. The resulting redirect from main space to user space then had to be deleted. If and when the fan post evolves into an article that meets wiki standards, then it can be moved back. --Xymph (talk) 02:53, 19 June 2023 (CDT)

cool, thanks —The preceding unsigned comment was added by --unknown-- (talk • contribs) .

Wad template usage[edit]

I disagree with the usage of the wad template for the Voxel Doom page. When there's a titlepic or at least a title menu where a screenshot can be taken from (like i did for SRB2), it makes sense to use it. But in the case of Voxel Doom neither of these approaches work. The mod doesn't have a title of any sorts and simply adding a random in-game screenshot isn't the right approach here, since the in-game looks very much like vanilla Doom because the whole purpose of voxel monsters is that they look just like vanilla 2D if viewed straight. As a result a screenshot is unlikely to ever be added.

So i'd argue 'this' is very much one of those situations where the wad template is not applicable since the screenshot window can't be removed and leaving it permanently empty looks rather ugly. So not using it solves the problem. Which is why i didn't. And you also seemed to be ok with this since you didn't correct it initially. There are also plenty of examples of gameplay mod page that do the same thing, so seems to be common practice for these kind of situations. --Gregor (talk) 10:22, 20 June 2023 (CDT)

Appearances that I am on top of everything, everywhere, all at once, can be deceiving. :-) There are many reasons why I don't initially edit an edit: too busy with something else (on-wiki, off-wiki, IRL), waiting for another editor to address something first, not thinking of an alternative approach until the next day, etc.

Using the wad template is better because it nicely organizes information in the top-right corner and generates cats automatically. That is its primary purpose, the image is optional. Just because you think the screenshot invitation message looks "rather ugly" is not a good enough reason not use the template, IMHO. Other gameplay mods don't have a screenshot either (yet?), but the template still serves its main purpose. Various other gameplay mods don't use the template, and maybe for a better reason than not having an appropriate image. So that doesn't mean someone should now go overboard on adding it everywhere, it depends on individual circumstances. Plenty level WADs don't have a screenshot yet, but that's no reason to revert to manual cats until they do, either.

For Voxel Doom, if a screenshot is not so meaningful when "they look just like vanilla 2D if viewed straight", then how about making one from a angle (e.g. on the side of a monster that hasn't woken up yet, or of a rotating weapon)? And if that's too difficult, then maybe we need the wad template smarter (noshot=true parameter, similar to nocat=true in {{map}} ?) instead of dismissing it. --Xymph (talk) 12:52, 20 June 2023 (CDT)

Yeah, the option to remove the screenshot window would be a welcome addition. That would solve the problem and still allow the option to add one later. Always nice to have more options. I agree that the wad template should be used whenever possible. The only reason i didn't do it here is because i feel using in-game screenshot images in place of an official titlepic is undesirable, the screenshot window can't be removed and i saw other pages also didn't use one. But i now see the error in my ways. --Gregor (talk) 13:18, 20 June 2023 (CDT)

Removing wikilinks for author of Voxel Doom[edit]

I forgot to ask then, but why did you remove the wl for the name of the author, Cheello, from the Voxel Doom article and the Cacowards 2022 page, and in fact all articles on the wiki? So far his only contribution is this one mod, but Voxel Doom II is slated for release in the coming months, and his work on Voxel Doom (plus the Cacoward) warrants a potential page, no? Just curious, because there are many red links for other author pages that seem to be just fine. --Gregor (talk) 10:40, 27 June 2023 (CDT)

You mean all three articles? :) We have guidelines for people articles and the main criterium is to have done something notable, with most examples being plural. I don't follow mod plans and unreleased mods explicitly don't count anyway. Other criteria are gaming-related personal information and external resources (like a personal Doom page or a YT/Twitch channel). When none of that is available, like in this case (as far as I could find), then what would probably result is a one line/one work stub page. Does that help the wiki? I think not, we have plenty stub pages like that already, and it's very unlikely many will ever get enough content to be de-stubbed. See also the related discussion about mappers. So I think we shouldn't automatically redlink people names as has happened often in the past and have occasionally unlinked others -- but I don't have time, inclination or enough insight to go a pruning spree through the entire wiki, nor is that the intention of the criteria. Thus the existence of other people redlinks, nor thin stub pages, shouldn't weigh in heavily as precedents. As stated in the criteria, "determinations must be made on a case-by-case basis in many instances." So if in the future, Cheello releases another notable work that is covered on the wiki, then sure, create an article. And that is when it is the right time to (blue)link a name everywhere -- not now, preemptively and prematurely, IMO. --Xymph (talk) 12:57, 27 June 2023 (CDT)

Understood. Well, Cheello actually does have a YouTube channel, but i agree with the demand for multiple noteworthy releases. --Gregor (talk) 02:21, 28 June 2023 (CDT)

Heretic pre-release screenshots[edit]

Hello! Once again I need your advice. In one of the issues of CD-only magazine "Interactive Entertainment" I found several screenshots of pre-release version of Heretic (this was discussed on Doomworld in 2021). I think they are important for the wiki. I've edited them a little: removed black bars and corrected aspect ratio. But the question is - can I upload them using standard HerHex license? Because I didn't actually take them - it was either Raven or someone from the magazine's staff. Is any additional license tag needed? --Nockson (talk) 13:00, 6 July 2023 (CDT)

Not a specialist in this subject matter, but the screenshot-herhex license covers "the design and artwork depicted in the screenshot" -- not who took the shot. And it seems to me that this applies to pre-release shots just as much as post-release ones. See also e.g. Quasar's article for Hexen: Beyond Heretic Screenshots (hexenscn). --Xymph (talk) 17:02, 6 July 2023 (CDT)

Name change[edit]

Hey Xymph, sorry to bug you again, I know I'm a PITA but I swear this will be the last one. As I have completed my de-transitioning, could I ask you to add my real name (Cristiano Montanari) to my article (thelokk)? I'd do it myself but I'm afraid of breaking links or stuff like that. Thanks!

Disclaimer: this is no comment on any kind of transition, that's a personal matter. But there was a name addition 11 months ago, a name removal 6 months ago, and now there should be a name addition again? Wtf? Each time this affects the wiki on dozens of pages and it's the kind of double/triple work nobody likes. So for the wiki it would better to just stick to the alias. --Xymph (talk) 08:50, 14 July 2023 (CDT)

Thing counting on maps[edit]

Hi, after looking at the table of things for Tribute Quilt, I discovered a few unfortunately placed difficulty flags that I'd like to fix and re-upload fixed version to idgames while it's not too late. Should I then fix the table manually, or ask you to run your bot again? --ViolentBeetle (talk) 16:53, 10 August 2023 (CDT)

When the second re-upload is moved into newstuff, I'll grab it and rerun the bot script. --Xymph (talk) 02:12, 11 August 2023 (CDT)

Freedoom Phase 2 music[edit]

Hi Frans, can you please help with cleaning up this WIP page a little? e.g. adding a description like the other soundtrack pages? Thanks. Blursphere (talk) 16:49, 21 August 2023 (CDT)

Nope, no knowledge about, nor spare time for, that topic. --Xymph (talk) 16:51, 21 August 2023 (CDT)

Categorization[edit]

Hi! Regarding this and this edits: I did it so the articles wouldn't get lost in a sea of source ports' names. Another way to fix this is to create a category called "Source ports by name". What do you think? --Nockson (talk) 13:17, 24 August 2023 (CDT)

With the sizable influx of port articles in the past year or two, I agree it's time for "Source ports by name", analog to subcat "PWADs by name". Then the related but non-primary topics don't need a sorting asterisk anymore. The ones currently still using an asterisk are fine though. --Xymph (talk) 13:52, 24 August 2023 (CDT)

I've created the subcat. Should I manually move cats there or is there some way to automate this process? --Nockson (talk) 14:19, 24 August 2023 (CDT)

Automation - we don't want to clutter RC with +/- 170 tiny edits, and I guess you're not too eager about such a monotonous job either. But I don't have a script ready for this particular task, so it'll take some coding/preparation. Patience. --Xymph (talk) 14:52, 24 August 2023 (CDT)

Great, thanks! I know you don't like RC clutter, that's why I asked. (I sometimes like to perform monotonous activities, they help to relax my brain a little.) --Nockson (talk) 15:00, 24 August 2023 (CDT)

I think I weeded out the actual ports from the related articles. Main SP cat is now much more manageable indeed. --Xymph (talk) 12:23, 27 August 2023 (CDT)

Yes, it looks much better. Thank you! --Nockson (talk) 12:31, 27 August 2023 (CDT)

Article deletion[edit]

Hello. I would like my DoomWiki article (https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Thelokk) to be deleted and protected from recreation. Thanks. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Thelokk (talk • contribs) .

I am sorry, but what is the reason for this? Besides the work needed to restructure so many articles to match this new reality, I hope you realize a wiki page is not a personal space, but a neutral catalogue of information that is useful for people to have when looking up WADs and such. --Dynamo128 (talk) 14:29, 2 September 2023 (CDT)

My bad, had an episode, disregard the above request. Will make sure it doesn't happen again. Thelokk (talk) 04:06, 6 September 2023 (CDT)

On Sep 4, you had the idgames archive maintainers remove eight of your works from the archive. That is your right, but raises the question: why? You removed six of them from your wiki article... oookay. But yesterday, the other two were re-uploaded: 12ep.zip exactly the same as before, and boa2kd.zip with changes to the .wad but not the .txt. They ended up at the same paths in the archive, but because of the intermediate removals, received a new ids in the Doomworld interface, requiring another update. Updating releases should be done by simply uploading a new version, with an optional note to the maintainers, then they will keep the same id. And the identical 12ep.zip removal/re-upload was completely unnecessary.

Nope, I don't think your "episode" ended. --Xymph (talk) 02:44, 8 September 2023 (CDT)

I took note of the same thing myself and was going to ask if there was any particular reason behind the deletions but ultimately decided against it. Either way, as far as the wiki is concerned, I'm willing to guess we generally want any person's body of work to be as complete as possible, including works that are no longer available for one reason or another. It is information after all, and a wiki's mission is generally to preserve as much of it as possible to my understanding. That said, Thelokk's choices are their own, and if they prefer to have parts of their history removed (as sad as it makes me that they would in the first place), I'm not one to stop them. --MF38 (talk) 03:03, 8 September 2023 (CDT)

I agree about information preservation, but if there is no link left for a file, then there's little point in preserving only the file's name. Exception is of course when the work already has a wiki article. I checked DSDA but it didn't have those six files. I could have gone on a wider search or tried the Wayback Machine, but that didn't seem worth the trouble. --Xymph (talk) 03:46, 8 September 2023 (CDT)

Episode replacement[edit]

Hello! I want to fix all inclusions of the word "episode" that are used for mods and not for IWADs. What do you think is the correct name for them: "episode replacement" or "episode replacement mod/WAD"? --Nockson (talk) 16:26, 11 September 2023 (CDT)

Replacement already indicates it's a mod, and the target paragraph already defines it as a "set of fan-made levels". So, the former suffices. Btw, replacing existing wikilinks to Megawad#Episode_replacement from before the redirect to the same, would not be a wise use of time. Only where episode is used where ep.replacement was meant, would be useful to update, as you did a few times already. --Xymph (talk) 16:47, 11 September 2023 (CDT)

Heretic HUD Face[edit]

Hi, I noticed that the HUD face used in Heretic's deathmatch mode looks quite similar to the player character's face in prior Raven release Shadowcaster (the resemblance is more clear if you resize Kurt's face to the dimensions of Heretic's HUD). Where should/would I put this information, and how? MargaretThatcher (talk) 15:30, 22 September 2023 (CDT)

Not familiar with this topic area. --Xymph (talk) 16:02, 22 September 2023 (CDT)

We have a status bar article, add it to the Heretic section there. --Dynamo128 (talk) 16:20, 22 September 2023 (CDT)

Correction: The face actually appears in the intermission screen post-deathmatch. I don't know what page this would fit, though.MargaretThatcher (talk) 17:33, 22 September 2023 (CDT)

Possibly new glitch?[edit]

Was playing doom 3 Resurrection of Evil and a pretty goofy but also very intriguing glitch happened to me. I’m on an iPhone, is there any way to upload a video into here? . NewsReporter (talk) 16:02, 25 September 2023 (CDT)

No, and the wiki isn't the place for speculation about possible glitches anyway. You could start a topic on Doomworld, it might not be new either. But if it is and if it's worth documenting on the wiki, then the topic can be used as reference. --Xymph (talk) 16:25, 25 September 2023 (CDT)

WADCAT full name[edit]

Hello! Could you please comment here because you renamed that page using a supposedly incorrect name. --Nockson (talk) 16:10, 1 October 2023 (CDT)

Pyroscourge/Pieruskwurje[edit]

Hello! I've updated Pyroscourge alias (see this post). Is there a way to automate the process of changing their category in all the map pages too or should I do it manually? Also, [[:Category:StarScream levels|this category]] should be merged with theirs. Can you please explain how to properly do that? --Nockson (talk) 06:11, 19 October 2023 (CDT)

All done. I don't think it is really necessary to update the alias in the intros of map pages or the WAD articles though - that is how those releases were published at the time. --Xymph (talk) 06:24, 19 October 2023 (CDT)

Thank you! --Nockson (talk) 06:28, 19 October 2023 (CDT)

Code tags[edit]

Hey, I've got a small question: should I replace all instances of html code tags with the c template? I saw you did this to tt tags (and remembered it as the right thing to do), but I'm not sure about the code because it looks different - it has some sort of frame which the c template lacks. --Nockson (talk) 12:49, 9 November 2023 (CST)

There's a guideline about those. Inline <code> tags are still used in special situations like code pointers and alike, but normally the 'c' template should be used. --Xymph (talk) 13:13, 9 November 2023 (CST)

Ah, thanks! Just fixed it here. --Nockson (talk) 13:17, 9 November 2023 (CST)

That falls under "alike" situations, I'd say. And in cases like a command-line parameter with an argument, it also visually helps to group them together. I suppose there's a grey area here... --Xymph (talk) 13:31, 9 November 2023 (CST)

Unreviewed redirects[edit]

Hello! I see a lot of old valid redirects in Special:UnreviewedPages. I've just checked two of them - Icon of Sin and Icon Of Sin. Is it right? Should I proceed? --Nockson (talk) 11:02, 21 November 2023 (CST)

I started on those yesterday already (and wrote a script against the database to assist and did speedy deletes of meaningless/unused ones), so thanks for asking but let's not both go in there. Also, capitalizing any wiki link/redirect is unnecessary since MediaWiki already capitalizes the resulting HTML link. Instead, perhaps you can add PUSS28 to all participating mappers? --Xymph (talk) 11:10, 21 November 2023 (CST)

Got it! Will do PUSS then. --Nockson (talk) 11:17, 21 November 2023 (CST)

All done. --Xymph (talk) 15:55, 24 November 2023 (CST)

I can't help but ask again, because I see that you've created several "missing" redirects, is there a need to create redirects for Final Doom in the format "Level XX"? (see section "Two questions about redirects" above, from June of this year) --Nockson (talk) 16:03, 24 November 2023 (CST)

Back in 2008-2009, TheGreenHerring went to some length to create shortcut redirects sans PWAD name, but in a megawad series sometimes forgot one or several. I merely completed those series for consistency, but didn't even bother with Hell Revealed II which goes only up to MAP10. For Final Doom, only Plutonia MAP30 and MAP32 have 'Level xx' redirects, and the MAP30 ones aren't even properly capitalized. None are used anywhere, so I'm more inclined to remove those, and leave only the MAP32 ones since that's probably Final Doom's most renowned/notorious level. Beyond that, my answer remains the same, I don't see the point in expanding the old terminology. --Xymph (talk) 11:16, 25 November 2023 (CST)

For what it's worth, I agree with Xymph here, especially considering that currently, in virtually every section of the community, the terminology of "MAPXX" is absolutely widespread and widely understood in a way that it may not have been in the past where terms like Level 01 may have been more liberally used in such contexts. I think Level XX redirects are wholly anachronistic as a result, and not needed. --Dynamo128 (talk) 11:21, 25 November 2023 (CST)

Thank you both for your answers! Consider this case closed. --Nockson (talk) 11:32, 25 November 2023 (CST)

Trouble with redirects' anchors[edit]

Hello! I want to make redirects for all Heretic cheat codes and link them to the table in the article, similar to Doom codes. However, redirects with anchors (in preview mode) for some reason continue to point to the beginning of the article, and not to the corresponding row inside the table (that is, when I open a link from a preview of the redirect). I suspected the problem was with the c template, so I removed them, but nothing changed. Do you know what can cause this? Am I doing something wrong? --Nockson (talk) 14:34, 2 December 2023 (CST)

Add span id's like in Doom cheat codes. --Xymph (talk) 14:38, 2 December 2023 (CST)

Thanks! It's nice to learn something new. --Nockson (talk) 14:56, 2 December 2023 (CST)

Notability, self-promotion and redlinks[edit]

In the interest of getting some clarification to the ongoing discussions about notability and self-promotion, how do you feel about WAD authors creating pages for their own works if they've already been redlinked? I'm mostly asking this in relation to the redlinks for Gomorrah, which I've been contemplating creating a page for but refraining from out of respect for the rules against self-promotion. Would you see it as such if I were the one to create the page, given that I'm the wad's author? And more importantly, do you deem Gomorrah notable enough to warrant a wiki page in the first place? --MF38 (talk) 04:50, 3 January 2024 (CST)

Thanks for asking. It was Dynamo who redlinked it and the release topic looks favorable, so it seems notable indeed. Thus I think you creating the article is no problem. --Xymph (talk) 05:10, 3 January 2024 (CST)

Alright, thanks for the swift response! --MF38 (talk) 05:43, 3 January 2024 (CST)

Sorry![edit]

Apologies for editing the Bonus level page "live" while you were constantly approving my edits. I should probably learn how to use my userspace as a sandbox before properly publishing edits. Individualised (talk) 06:01, 23 February 2024 (CST)

Not necessarily, but please use the Show Preview and Show Changes buttons to carefully and repeatedly check your edits before submitting them. --Xymph (talk) 06:03, 23 February 2024 (CST)

Mapper stub[edit]

Sorry for poking but, since I can't find the relevant info, what does it take exactly to remove the 'stub' status from a mapper's page? personal trivia? info on projects outside of Doom? a certain number of external links? Thanks in advance 109.54.167.114 20:32, 11 April 2024 (CDT)

An intro of one generic sentence, which most mapper pages start with (from this script), is stubby. Once there is more meat on that bone, or indeed other parts of the article besides the main body of work, it no longer is stubby, I guess. There is no strong guideline, but it follows from the policy and FAQ that incomplete articles are tagged 'stub'. Once it's complete "enough" the template can be removed, although that is subjective to page and person. --Xymph (talk) 04:56, 12 April 2024 (CDT)

Doom Power[edit]

Hi! There are a few issues with dp template. First, it is called forum, not forums, just check the upper central part of its main page (in mobile view at least). Second and most important - the forum is sometimes purged and archived, which will imo F up all of the links. Archives are stored here. --Nockson (talk) 06:28, 15 April 2024 (CDT)

In English, I thought a forums system (like phpBB) is referred to in plural, but google search results indicate that opinions vary, and it can also be called a forum (with sub-forums). So either way is fine with me. I am aware of their (self-inflicted) archive problem, and added support now. --Xymph (talk) 07:18, 15 April 2024 (CDT)

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 == Archived discussions ==
-<div class="dw-div-dl">'''[[User talk:Xymph/2016|2016]]'''</div>
+<div class="dw-div-dl">'''[[User talk:Xymph/2016|2016]]''' | '''[[User talk:Xymph/2017-18|2017-2018]]''' | '''[[User talk:Xymph/2019-21|2019-2021]]'''</div>
-== External link editing ==
-Hi Xymph.&nbsp; I'm not sure about deleting items from Sources sections [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=E3M4:_All_the_Marbles_%28Serenity%29&curid=12091&diff=136044&oldid=136039].&nbsp; That probably means it was the source of some content in ''that'' article specifically (e.g. the readme, or some trivia in the DW reviews).&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] (''[[Special:PermaLink/113430|usually gone]]'') 13:31, 24 February 2017 (CST)
-: Well, you should know, as you created the [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=E3M4:_All_the_Marbles_%28Serenity%29&oldid=60854 initial revision] which already contained the link. :) Upon further reading, it is related to the "Inspiration and development" mention about "Nathrath's Fab Four". That just wasn't clear, as other Sources entries often have more info [[MAP25: Cesspool (Memento Mori)#Sources|like this]] or use a reference to link it to the place where it's used. With neither, I got the impression the idgames link was used just [[Outpost 21#Sources|like here]], and that seemed redundant as indicated by my removal reason.
-: I'll fix them up, including the mix-ups where M5 (in the other collection) didn't get a sources link &ndash; nor did M2 &ndash; while M6 (not in it) did. ;) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 15:00, 24 February 2017 (CST)
-:: Thank you.&nbsp; FTR I was prepared to hear reasoning for not listing certain sources, which has happened in the past.&nbsp; And I ''should'' know, but I don't, because it was such a disorganized period that I'm thankful to have remembered the difference between square and curly brackets each time.&nbsp; :>
-:: The general point about {{wp|Wikipedia:Citing sources#Inline citations|footnotes}} is a good one (but a completely separate project, I think!).&nbsp; Long story short, the situation you describe does confuse people, but it is a huge and probably non-bottable task to fix it.&nbsp; I personally would be OK with uniform use of inline references if everyone had put some thought into the question and decided they were good.&nbsp; I don't believe that is currently the case.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] (''[[Special:PermaLink/113430|usually gone]]'') 15:28, 24 February 2017 (CST)
-== Fixes ==
-Thank you for all your fixes. [[User:Ducon|Ducon]] ([[User talk:Ducon|talk]]) 07:38, 21 May 2017 (CDT)
-: No problem, we all build on previous contributions. If you're going to do more map series, I can help creating the map skeletons [[User:XymphBot|bot-wise]]. It improves consistency and leaves you more time to write information and descriptions, and add screenshots (which are still needed for a gazillion map pages). --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 07:44, 21 May 2017 (CDT)
-::I’m taking screenshots for the top 100 WADs and for the cacowarded maps, thus, I create pages for such maps. [[User:Ducon|Ducon]] ([[User talk:Ducon|talk]]) 07:49, 21 May 2017 (CDT)
-::: I'm working on the same, so we can collaborate, like we did implicitly yesterday :) and previously on [[IC2005]]. After you create an overview page like [[Vae Victus 2]], you could leave it to me to create the individual map pages with all the basic info that the bot scripts can add. Then you resume with the screens and other info. Of course I'm not always available to do that immediately, so it takes perhaps a little planning ahead (and occasionally patience) for this to work for you too. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 08:12, 21 May 2017 (CDT)
-::::Great. I’m going to play Classic episode 2 (https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/levels/doom/Ports/a-c/class_e2). [[User:Ducon|Ducon]] ([[User talk:Ducon|talk]]) 13:59, 21 May 2017 (CDT)
-::::: Fine, so create the [[The Classic Episode, Part 2|WAD overview page]] with sufficient info, then I'll follow with the map pages. And for future WADs you gonna play, creating the overview page will again be my cue &ndash; no further posts here necessary. Have fun! --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:25, 21 May 2017 (CDT)
-== Woodexial's Secrets ==
-I'm using GZDoom's automap instead of an editor and it shows only 7 secrets instead of 8. Was Sector 188 is the one with a <s>C</s>cacodemon and a backpack in a pit? --[[User:ZeroTheEro|ZeroTheEro]] ([[User talk:ZeroTheEro|talk]]) 19:20, 22 May 2017 (CDT)
-: Yes, 188 is the sector just before that pit. I did only a fly-thru, clipping on/off as needed to get to places and trigger the secrets, but the automap in ZDoom does show x/8 secrets too. Not sure how to make it reveal the sector number, and why you got most of them differently than they are stored in the map. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:31, 23 May 2017 (CDT)
-::To put it simply, the sector numbers didn't match the secret because I have no idea how to check it. I'm just having guesswork on the sector number since I list the secrets by gradual progression. Please correct me if I am wrong. --[[User:ZeroTheEro|ZeroTheEro]] ([[User talk:ZeroTheEro|talk]]) 04:28, 23 May 2017 (CDT)
-::: I see. But in skeleton pages the secret sectors are simply in numeric order rather than play progression. I'd rather not be correcting them all the time though. ;) To match the numbers to sectors in the map, I use [[DeePsea]]: switch to sector mode with the mouse scroll-wheel, use the 'j' key to bring up the jump dialog, and enter the number to be taken to that highlighted sector. There may be other/better ways in other editors. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 04:44, 23 May 2017 (CDT)
-:::: Thanks, yo. --[[User:ZeroTheEro|ZeroTheEro]] ([[User talk:ZeroTheEro|talk]]) 13:23, 23 May 2017 (CDT)
-:: Hi Xymph.&nbsp; Not to open another can of worms here&nbsp; ;>&nbsp; but you mean that ''bot-generated'' skeletons use numeric order.&nbsp; IME human editors adding descriptions tend to reorder them [[E2M2: Containment Area (Doom)#Secrets|along the base walkthrough route]], in hopes that's clearer for the newbies.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] (''[[Special:PermaLink/113430|usually gone]]'') 11:30, 26 May 2017 (CDT)
-:::That wording is indeed more accurate, and what I meant in general. Although it has also happened that a contributor added the sector numbers manually without descriptions, e.g. from DeePsea's search results for sector type, and those would also be in numeric order. I'd still call that skeleton lists, but once a contributor has added descriptions I'd no longer consider that section a skeleton anymore. And of course the order can then be any that is best suited for the pertaining map. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 13:11, 26 May 2017 (CDT)
-== XymphBot and skeletons (again) ==
-Hi Xymph,
-I'm just now beginning to examine some bot edits in more detail.&nbsp; It's still amazing how many features you managed to add in a short time.&nbsp; Anyone who has started a few dozen pages from scratch will appreciate the massive efficiency gain (with respect to both actual writing and interlarded decompression :D
-I notice that you sometimes return to address an issue manually, e.g.:
-# [[Special:Diff/118391|erasing a footnote]]
-# [[Special:Diff/118244|removing a category]]
-# [[Special:Diff/121463|adding a template that was already present]]
-# [[Special:Diff/121766|transposing a heading with a paragraph]]
-You've forgotten more about programming than I'll ever know&nbsp; :>&nbsp; so perhaps you added validations to the code as needed, or the bot itself alerted you when existing text didn't match the standard form.&nbsp; But if that wasn't possible (because string parsing is very hard), '''I would like to help by finding any remaining similar issues'''.&nbsp; Is there a way to narrow down relevant edits of each type, e.g. by time stamps or canned edit summaries?
-Yes, I've complained about gameplay articles attracting [[Special:Diff/50988/52982|hoi polloi revisions]] because of the low barrier to entry, but those still deserve to be [[Help:Page validation|evaluated in context]] by a human.
-Anyway, I hope that makes some sense, and thanks again for caring about our project.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 01:33, 12 July 2017 (CDT)
-: Thanks for the com(pli)ments. Also, I'm glad to see you becoming more active again. I don't follow "interlarded decompression" though, is that one of your Dr Who terms? ;)
-: Regarding manual touch-ups: yes sometimes the pattern matching is too tricky, but usually it's a trade-off between effort and gain.
-: 1. Footnotes between/below Things tables are very rare so I simply didn't bother trying to code for them, as it would be harder than manually restoring them. <br/> 2. On most map pages the Statistics section is followed by other (stub-)sections. The MW API &ndash; and thus [[User:XymphBot#Scripts|dmmpstBot.php]] &ndash; allows updating a single (sub)section, but category lines don't form their own section and are simply included in the last one. So in case of those Heretic pages the cats got stripped off by the bot edit because I didn't code for the possibility of any being ''in'' the Statistics section, as pages usually have External links headers and such in between. Additionally, conventionsBot.php warns me of category lines embedded somewhere else than at the end of pages. Lastly, the bot removals of the unnecessary "Levels by name" cats were actually convenient, as those could be dropped from all Heretic pages, while the firemace cat only needed to be re-added on 20 of them. <br/> 3. That happened because mapviewBot.php didn't take the empty line before the existing mapspots template into account. It's too long ago to remember exactly, but glancing over the code it could be that mapviewBot.php handles it correctly now. I must admit that sometimes I reviewed the interactive diffs too hastily and submitted edits needing manual clean-up which I then addressed in the pertaining script. <br/> 4. This page stood out because of the non-standard walkthrough formatting, but I didn't bother cleaning it up beyond the header move so that skeletonBot.php and mapviewBot.php wouldn't complain.
-: For cases 1 and 2, since dmmpstBot.php shows me the diff before actually submitting the edit, I know where to return to and manually restore things, and I also manually review all pages in a series afterwards. Thus I'm pretty sure I didn't leave (m)any loose ends of issues caused by bot edits, but I may have slipped up on occasion. I can't think of a pattern by which to locate them though.
-: For me the fun is both in programming and thus helping myself/others avoid tedious jobs (that were evidently hard to execute consistently and completely), and improving DW's content and presentation of factual information. After a year and a half, I do consider it ''my'' project too. :)
-: Some statistics: in my archive are 166 [[User:XymphBot#Configuration|.ini files]] (including three for all single-level Doom, Doom II and Heretic PWADs) covering 3499 map pages.
-: So, much thanks for the offer of help and sorry for not being able to point you directly in the desired, uhh, direction. It you're still undeterred after all the above, [[User:XymphBot#How_can_you_help.3F|here's how]] you (or anyone) can help. However, currently I'm immersed in INFO.c tools programming and subsequently transferring their output to the wiki, so combined with real-life interference it may take a while before I can return to bot-based map page updates. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 07:32, 12 July 2017 (CDT)
-:: Thank you; that is quite informative.&nbsp; There's certainly no rush, and I hope the bold text didn't imply otherwise.&nbsp; (I ''did'' reread the discussions first, so I'm glad I hadn't overlooked something obvious in your updates.)
-:: I'm learning that "active" is a floating-point quantity&nbsp; :>&nbsp; so e.g. I will hesitate to join a project systematically playtesting megawads.&nbsp; That said, I already had [[User:XymphBot#How can you help?|your list]] bookmarked because some of those articles appeared hastily during [[Doom Wiki:RFC/Missing PWAD articles|an RFC]], which I suspected would cause trouble for somebody.&nbsp; Now that I know it's XymphBot, its previously successful PWADs can serve as examples to follow.
-:: Re "decompression" &mdash; AFAICT it's a common experience that long, tedious jobs may be followed by an unrelated mindless task to clear one's head, before one can return to a different demanding activity.&nbsp; It's hard to plan for, especially with real-life concerns present, so it's another reason bots are great.&nbsp; :D&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 16:44, 12 July 2017 (CDT)
-&larr;&larr;&larr;
-Hi again.&nbsp; I've changed (hopefully improved) [[Template:Map skel]] slightly; does that affect XymphBot at all?&nbsp; I dimly remembered that it did, but now I can't find the original discussion (oops...), only several cousins:
-* A tiny IRC excerpt, very inconclusive but did mention the [[Special:PermaLink/103332|garbled introduction]] (now fixed)
-* [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing/2016#Standard map sections?|This thread]] in which you were using the template as a reference, but for manual edits
-* [[Special:PermaLink/117539|Parameters to templates within the template]], which sounds resolved (and AFAICT wouldn't interfere either way, unless we tried to pass default parameters)
-If I'm barking up the wrong tree again, just say so.&nbsp; :>&nbsp;&nbsp; I did not have to change any headings to match [[E3M2 (Base Ganymede)|our newest articles]], which presumably means you and the other "map regulars" had already applied your usual thoroughness.&nbsp; In theory there might be additional tricks available, e.g. reading the slot automatically from the page title, but I would like to keep the markup simple because non-regulars sometimes create map pages (especially after Cacowards).&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 00:31, 17 July 2017 (CDT)
-: You may be remembering the remark at the end of [[Template:Things]]. But DMMPST includes its own copies of the templates it uses, so there is no direct consequence. However for consistency, I similarly dropped the ftp: stub and added the [[Adding custom music]] wikilink; and adopted the dummy NavboxTemplateGoesHere line for which I had to update navboxBot.php as well. Thanks for the &ndash; indeed &ndash; improvements. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 08:28, 17 July 2017 (CDT)
+== Hexen Mac demo maps ==
-== "Revert misguided spots formatting" ==
+Maps 1 and 4 are fully functional in the program they're made for, but not anything else I know of. I can try and record a video if necessary. - [[User:SiFi270|SiFi270]] ([[User talk:SiFi270|talk]]) 10:30, 31 December 2021 (CST)
-Hi Xymph.&nbsp; This function appears not to detect multiple letters within the same parentheses.&nbsp; For example, [[Special:Diff/125770/125771|here]] the text {{c|<nowiki>''(J, K)''</nowiki>}} was unchanged.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 06:52, 16 August 2017 (CDT)
+: That doesn't seem supported by the reference linked: "A lot of lumps are far too small (4 bytes or less) to actually contain anything useful. MAP01 and MAP04 are made unplayable this way." I interpreted that as the lumps belonging to those two MAPs themselves being too small to be meaningful. If they are, in fact, proper maps playable only in the Mac demo itself, then the wording should make that clearer (I modified your edit because it wasn't clear enough, to me anyway). --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 10:42, 31 December 2021 (CST)
+::I honestly have no recollection of what I did or didn't do back then. It's certainly possible the code I used to extract stuff was flawed and failed on these two maps. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 05:42, 9 January 2022 (CST)
+::: Could you re-check and update [[HEXEN.WAD#Mac_demo|the relevant section]] if necessary? I don't have time for this, nor the tooling. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:12, 9 January 2022 (CST)
-: Good catch, thanks. Fixed for all Ultimate Doom maps, found none in the Doom2 map pages. Let me know if you find some in another map series. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 08:20, 16 August 2017 (CDT)
+== Yet another bot suggestion ==
+Would it be feasible to automatically look at a wad's Soundtrack section, and then edit accordingly the ''and uses the music track " "'' part of the corresponding map's skeleton? There's certainly a fair few cases to take into account (e.g. if it starts with "MIDI version of <blah>" proper grammar would require a formulation like "and uses as music track a MIDI version of <blah>") and I'm sure there's gonna be several caveats discovered due to the lack of complete consistency in these sections. Also things like REKKR or BTSX may cause confusions due to having several identical map lumps. But since generally soundtrack information focuses on a wad's main page and forgets about the map pages, that could, if possible, cut down on tedious busy work to copy-paste information from one page to another. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 05:42, 9 January 2022 (CST),.
+: Have pondered that a few times over the years, but "the lack of complete consistency" is exactly why I see this as unfeasible. Not just the variety of formatting styles but also the links (internal and to Wikipedia, both game titles and music artists/songs) that would need to be processed, make it an insurmountable task for me. And time-wise that doesn't even take my ballooning to-do list into account, both in covering the recent flood of new WADs and custom things lists for existing ones, as well as the DSDA demos tables still to be updated for many dozens of megawads (and then cleaning [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing#Broken links to doomedsda.us|remnant linking to old DSDA]]). I'm longing for the summer doldrums already. ;-) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 05:54, 9 January 2022 (CST)
+::Fair enough. Alternative suggestion: have the map skeleton be something like <code><nowiki>and uses the [[Adding custom music|music]] track "[[Category:Map pages without soundtrack information]]".</nowiki></code> so that would give a handy way to check manually which map articles need to be updated. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 06:59, 9 January 2022 (CST)
+::: Good idea, added to templates for future skeletons. Updating existing articles will take some additional scripting and a very long bot run. Please create the category. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 08:01, 9 January 2022 (CST)
+::: A few enhancements to [[User:XymphBot#pregreplGen.php|pregreplGen.php]] sufficed with several hours of running time. Now your category has 4500+ entries. Enjoy. ;-) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:31, 11 January 2022 (CST)
-== November featured article thread ==
+== Doomwiki edit limit faux pas ==
-''Which "both articles", RyanW?''&nbsp;&nbsp; &mdash; Hmm, probably just being sloppy with verb tenses again.&nbsp; "Both articles <u>will have been featured</u> when all is said and done, so there's <u>no harm done to the original goal</u> of showcasing the good work in both".&nbsp; Does that make sense?&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 17:49, 10 November 2017 (CST)
+Hy Xymph! First of all, thank you a lot for checking over my recent edits and all the work you've done for this community. I'm a big fan of what you do. Second, I was wondering if there's any unwritten rule about how many edits should an user do per day? I realize that I made quite a few edits in the last 24 hours and then realized that all those edits would have to be reviewed/verified by an editor with permissions, in this case it was you, so I'm a bit embarrassed at the thought of having to prompt so many reviews and take the time of somebody else. So I was wondering if there is a suggested limit of edits? Any recommendations? Thanks, mate. [[User:Endless01|Endless01]] ([[User talk:Endless01|talk]]) 04:26, 1 February 2022 (CST)
-: I don't dare to say 'no' anymore at this point. :-P <small>Yes</small> --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:38, 11 November 2017 (CST)
+: Thanks for the kind words. There is no rule/guideline about edit limits, and if there were, others already broke it in recent months. ;-) Fortunately a few other people also do reviews, but it is considerate of you to raise this topic. If you'd like to take one factor into account, you could take it easy on days that Recent Changes is already very busy with contributions by others, and do more on slow(er) days. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:30, 1 February 2022 (CST)
-== Report on Wikipedia linking? ==
+:: Happy to hear that then! I'll try to do a handful of edits during the weekdays, and see if I can work more during weekends. Happy to help out filling map stubs and making some other articles :D [[User:Endless01|Endless01]] ([[User talk:Endless01|talk]]) 16:56, 1 February 2022 (CST)
-Hi Xymph,
+:: You have been doing great work so far, thanks a lot for the time you're putting in this, and I look forward to more of your contributions :) --[[User:Dynamo128|Dynamo128]] ([[User talk:Dynamo128|talk]]) 17:30, 1 February 2022 (CST)
-''Ideas for future scripts, anyone?''&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&mdash;&nbsp;okay, what about a list of all links to Wikipedia meeting certain criteria?
+== Skeleton WAD pages ==
-There was a brief IRC discussion about [[Special:Diff/154637/154705|knock-on effects of Wikipedia deletions]].&nbsp; It can be argued that any game-related article aside from the main AAA releases is at risk.&nbsp; I would like to remediate this somehow, and as Quasar pointed out, that is much easier ''before'' the article is deleted.&nbsp; :7
+Hi mate! I've been creating some pages for single-level WADs and I was wondering if creating the skeletons as a initial step is the right way? Since I know there's some bots that take care of more technical stuff, I wasn't sure what was needed to be filled. Also, am I having the greatest deja vu ever but I could've swear I created the [[Dystopia Level]] page, but now it shows it was originally created in 2019? Did I miss something or am I going crazy? haha. - [[User:Endless01|Endless01]] ([[User talk:Endless01|talk]]) 03:05, 15 February 2022 (CST)
+: There is only [[User:XymphBot|one active bot account]] at this time, which is mainly used for map series, not much for single-level WADs. Skeletons are generated by [[DMMPST]] so if you put in all the sections I may have to delete some stuff that doesn't apply (like the [[Special:Diff/314546|DM section here]]) and add all the stats etc. So you might as well create single-level articles with just the intro & links sections and wad template, then I'll paste in all the intermediate sections.
+: Dystopia Level was a duplicate; initially I quickly deleted it, then changed my mind and added a redirect to the existing page [[Dystopia]]. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 03:19, 15 February 2022 (CST)
+:: Ah, I see! My bad then. I thought I searched the page to see if it was already done but I might have confused it. Next single-level PWAD page I create, I'll follow your instructions. I want to try and fill the gap that Doomer96 left. The work done by Doomer96 is is remarkable and I hope to help out as much, someday. Thanks a lot, as usual! :D - [[User:Endless01|Endless01]] ([[User talk:Endless01|talk]]) 03:29, 15 February 2022 (CST)
+::: Well, personally I thought the notability of the some of the WAD articles created by Doomer96 was questionable, but a lot of ground was covered indeed. And Doomer96 indeed used DMMPST to post complete skeletons with all the data, so it left less touch-up work for me (often only the map view), which was welcome. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 03:51, 15 February 2022 (CST)
+:::: Only responding now since I was out of town for a month or so, but in my absolutely humble, biased, and completely non-authoritative opinion, to "fill the gap that Doomer96 left" I say: yes please! :D --[[User:Dynamo128|Dynamo128]] ([[User talk:Dynamo128|talk]]) 01:59, 7 March 2022 (CST)
-It is of course your decision whether this sounds interesting (and whether you have time!).&nbsp; I have vague ideas about implementation details, which can and should be [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing/2016#Map thing statistics|finalized through general discussion]].&nbsp; I am asking you first, however, because if we don't have a bot then my initial proposal will change.&nbsp; :D
+== Vrack2BiggestEver... isn't the BiggestEver anymore? ==
-Thanks for reading, as always.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 17:03, 18 March 2018 (CDT)
+Hiya Xymph,
+I saw your DMMPST output for Vrack2BiggestEver - A test map of 5x Vrack2 combined into one.
+Well, from the same site, there is now a 2018 ''contender'' for VRack2BiggestEver as VRack2SuperHuge. It clocks in at 9.4 MB, compared to BiggestEver's 3.9 MB. Its also hosted by the Deep site. So if you want to hazard your luck for a test case, here it is - http://www.sbsoftware.com/files/vrack2-superhuge.zip --[[User:Redneckerz|Redneckerz]] ([[User talk:Redneckerz|talk]]) 12:01, 18 February 2022 (CST)
+: Oh, I wasn't, but... test passed. :) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:21, 18 February 2022 (CST)
+:: Much appreciated. I am almost disappointed it didn't do a dent to your utility :) But its good to have these results in and SuperHuge seems like some idiotic overkill :) Thanks for covering this. --[[User:Redneckerz|Redneckerz]] ([[User talk:Redneckerz|talk]]) 12:27, 18 February 2022 (CST)
-: Time, indeed, is of the essence :) and now that my .exe/iwad project is done, I wanted to turn to other things on my to-do list, on DoomWiki and elsewhere. But this sounds like a multi-day project rather than a multi-month one, so it's doable. Can you elaborate on what the script should do, across which pages against what criteria, producing what kind of output? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:51, 19 March 2018 (CDT)
+== DSDA Tables for main WAD pages ==
-:: I can respond, but it creates no obligation on your part.&nbsp; :>
+Xymph, I noticed that the bot is automatically updating DSDA tables for maps now. Do you think it's possible to get it to pull the D2ALL and Episode times and drop those into a table on the main WAD page as well? I'm not sure if this was already discussed or mentioned at all, or even how feasible it would be. [[User:Turbine2k6|Turbine2k6]] ([[User talk:Turbine2k6|talk]]) 10:23, 20 February 2022 (CST)
+: Already [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing#DSDA records tables|brought up]] (and on my to-do list before that), but with the workload generated for me in recent months by Dynamo, Matador, Endless and others, I have no idea if/when I'll get around to it... --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:34, 20 February 2022 (CST)
+:: I feel called out lol ): should I slow down my wiki output? - [[User:Endless01|Endless01]] ([[User talk:Endless01|talk]]) 17:58, 20 February 2022 (CST)
+::: It's not just you, WAD additions have been coming in full throttle most of the time since October, and it's wearing me out a bit. Only the latter half of November was quieter, allowing me to develop the DSDA map records script. That was when the redlinks count {{dwforums|126066|dipped below 1900}}, but this year it's never been below 2000 anymore. Partly due to DUMP2/3 and RAMP which added 348 map links just between them, and which I'm back-burnering because large mixed format WADs are too elaborate and time-consuming to handle until Omgifol supports UDMF (of which [https://github.com/devinacker/omgifol/pull/33 initial development] was recently resumed by Revenant). But I'm trying to keep up with all the other newly added WADs, there are not many other editors actively reviewing all contributions either, and all that just leaves little time/energy for scripting (apart from [[Special:Diff/313800|small stuff]] really needed asap).
+::: The wiki is a collaborative effort and a single editor shouldn't be a bottleneck, but for scripting I guess I am. So yeah, slowing down WAD additions until the backlog is cleared would increase the chance that major scripting projects happen sooner than later. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 09:33, 21 February 2022 (CST)
-:: Output would be a one-to-many mapping like this:
+== Hadephobia's original soundtrack ==
-:::: {| {{prettySortable}}
-! Wikipedia page !! Linked from
-|-
-| {{wp|GeForce 6 series}} || [[Aspect ratio]]<BR />[[:Category:Node builders]]<BR />[[Christoph Oelckers (Graf Zahl)]]<BR />[[Doom 3]]
-|-
-| {{wp|PTV (Family Guy)}} || [[Aspect ratio]]<BR />[[:File:Familyguy.jpg]]<BR />[[Shareware]]
-|}
-:: On any page where "encyclopedic" content is expected, sources might be added, so the territory would be namespaces 0, 4, 6, 10, 12, 14 ''except''
+Hi Xymph! Concerning Hadephobia's soundtrack, musics by PRIMEVAL and Jimmy were made specifically for this project. Should be sufficient for adding the "PWADs with original soundtrack" category ? {{unsigned|Pierrot}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Doom Wiki:Central Processing*</nowiki>}}
+: Must admit I didn't fully check the track count and credits, I just saw a whole bunch of non-original entries. 9-10 out of 35 still doesn't seem like a whole "soundtrack" to me, but now that I look at the category description, it turns out at least one song is all that is required. So, cat re-applied. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:29, 31 March 2022 (CDT)
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Doom Wiki:RFC*</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Help:Spam/Archive</nowiki>}}
-:: Criteria provide the most room for debate.&nbsp; If I did this manually, I would want two things:
+== Pain chance percentage values ==
-::# The ability to identify every link, even if added indirectly (interwiki, transclusion, etc).
-::# A conservative first pass to filter out less likely candidate links.&nbsp; Total volume is a bit too large to digest otherwise.
-:: I assume #1 can be addressed by requesting pages in HTML format.&nbsp; #2 is far more heuristic; options include
-::* For each Wikipedia article, read Wikipedia's category system to identify related areas (gaming, computing, scripture, ...).
-::* List only links formatted locally as references (citation tags, specific templates, ...).
-::* List only links under whitelisted section titles.
-:: I would choose the last approach.&nbsp; The second would be very incomplete (indeed one motivation is to clean up sloppy citations from a decade ago).&nbsp; The first would be beating the bot's head against the scale and nonlinearity of Wikipedia's categories, at least until it got blocked.&nbsp; I did manage to compile promising titles already:
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Additional information</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Bibliography</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Credits</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Discography</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Encyclopedia</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>External link</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>External links and references</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>External links:</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>External links</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Footnotes</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>General info</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>General source material</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Info</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Information</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Misc.</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Misc</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Miscellaneous</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>More information</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Note</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Notes</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Other links</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Other notes</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Other references</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Other</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Publications</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Published works</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Reference/glossary section</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>References</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Related articles</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Related links</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Related</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Resources</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>See also</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Source</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Sources</nowiki>}}
-::* {{c|<nowiki>Useful pages</nowiki>}}
-:: In this context, a "section" ideally comprises all text until the next header at the same level.&nbsp; The next header at any level is likely 99% accurate however.
-:: This post represents only my personal hypotheses, subject to later consensus-building and any needed [[User talk:Xymph/Pages starting with an article|compromises]] regarding what is or is not feasible to code.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 17:34, 19 March 2018 (CDT)
+Hi, right now I am reading https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Pain_state that you directed me to after my edit revision, and it blew my mind! Thanks! {{unsignedIP|31.60.37.116}}
+:You're welcome. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:36, 27 April 2022 (CDT)
-:: Further idea: this probably needs a throttle to avoid mass image uploads, which link pages such as {{wp|Fair use}} through templates, and in practice have section structures varying by user.&nbsp; If the search returns more than 25 results (say) for the same external link in the same namespace, just write '''{{c|<nowiki>[26 pages in namespace 6]</nowiki>}}''' or something.&nbsp; If it's clearly an unusual case, I'll deal with it manually.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 23:18, 22 March 2018 (CDT)
+== Dating the wad ==
-::: The past two days of work on the script resulted in a [[User:Xymph/List_of_Wikipedia_links|fair amount of progress]]. The last run went over 5 of the 6 namespaces, excluding main &ndash; I don't have an idea of the link volume in the latter yet. Because runs over that many pages take a long time, the script logs its progress like this:
+Hi, I noticed you moved Modest Mapping II into 2021 on my page. What is the policy to date the wads in general? Because I went with idgame upload date and it was yesterday or so. Probably not something that will come up very often, but who knows. --[[User:ViolentBeetle|ViolentBeetle]] ([[User talk:ViolentBeetle|talk]]) 13:41, 19 July 2022 (CDT)
+: I believe (without looking for sources) that long ago, the idgames upload was indeed considered the release date, and the trigger to start wiki coverage. But in recent years, so many WADs were released in beta or RC in the forums, and added to the wiki with the forums date, that the line has blurred. In particular because such WADs were occasionally Cacowarded before the idgames upload, or lingered in the forums without ever getting uploaded.
+: So when an RC gets covered on the wiki by someone, as was the case for MM2 (on [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Contributions/BuildCat&offset=20210308143141&limit=6&target=BuildCat less than half], not all associated mapper articles), with the forums date, I just use that for consistency. But the more convoluted a mod's release history, the more approximate that entry is going to be, I suppose. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:19, 19 July 2022 (CDT)
- Attempting to log in... Success.
+== Bot problem ==
- collecting Wikipedia namespaces:  34
+I noticed an apparent false positive edit by XymphBot, [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Official_Doom_FAQ/Original_text&diff=351139&oldid=166622 here], which was obvious as the page is not meant to be edited at all. If you can ensure this case gets ignored in the future I will revert it at that point. Appears the intent was to be editing wikilinks but apparently it also somehow matched this text in the middle of a pre-formatted block. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 00:50, 27 August 2022 (CDT)
+: [[User:XymphBot#pregreplGen.php|pregreplGen.php]] doesn't know about pre-formatted blocks or pristine pages, it's a simple search & replace script, prompting me to confirm each change. I recall hesitating at the FAQ but didn't think much of it. Evidently thought wrong/too little. :) Reverted, and since there's nothing autonomous about XymphBot, it won't happen again. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:52, 27 August 2022 (CDT)
- processing 'Doom Wiki'...
- processed:    43 pages
- processing 'File'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:32in24_MAP09_hilltop.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:AnimFace.gif... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Cchest4_MAP13.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:CommunityChest-map12-mud.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Congestion1024-map19-end.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:DTWID-LE_E2M8_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Doom3_weapons_07.jpg... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Doom_v0.3_thestore.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:E3M4_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Eternity-e2m1-s.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:H2H-Xmas_MAP31_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Heretic-e3m4-snail.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Interception_MAP04_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Kansams_Trial_E2M7_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:MM_MAP02_Secret.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:MementoMori2-map04-down.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:NDCP-map23-torches.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Origwad_2.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Psx-command-control-start.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Requiem-map27-end.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Scythe2_MAP03_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Stardate20X6.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:TheEvilUnleashed-e3m5-cage.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Vile_Flesh_MAP11_map.png... 100 200
- processed: 12260 pages
- processing 'Template'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Template' from Template:MAYhem_1500_21-30... 100 200 300 400
- processed:   940 pages
- processing 'Help'...
- processed:     8 pages
- processing 'Category'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:Easter_eggs... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:MrGuyTodd_levels... 100 200 300 400
- processed:  1491 pages
-::: Some info about what listWikiLinks.php does:
+:: Alright thanks. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 11:28, 27 August 2022 (CDT)
-:::* init namespace lists and patterns; at first I used an API call to get Wikipedia's namespace list, then hard-coded it to save a call; in the exception list, {{c|<nowiki>Template:Wikipedia</nowiki>}} and {{c|<nowiki>Template:Wp</nowiki>}} were also needed
-:::* the regex patterns are: '{{c|<nowiki>{{wp\|(.+?)(?:\|.+?)?}}</nowiki>}}', '{{c|<nowiki>\[\[Wikipedia:(.+?)(?:\|.+?)?\]\]</nowiki>}}', and '{{c|<nowiki>\[https?://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/(.+?)(?: .+?)?\]</nowiki>}}'
-:::* from all selected namespaces, lists of pages are queried at 500 per batch and each page is then fetched and searched for the link patterns; this is the most time-consuming part, so a progress marker is logged every 100 pages
-:::* all data is collected in an array (keyed by Wikipedia path) of arrays (with DoomWiki paths), which are all [http://www.php.net/manual/en/function.sort.php#refsect1-function.sort-parameters sorted with flags] SORT_NATURAL and SORT_FLAG_CASE
-:::* the tables are generated by traversing the data array for each Wikipedia namespace; for entries with more than 20 DW links, a ''more'' value is appended
-::: Filtering of WP links is not implemented yet, I'm not sure that's wise. For one thing, quite a few WP links occur in the intro (section 0) of a page, so that should be in your list too. For another, perhaps the link volume isn't overwhelming, I am now running the script on main space only to find out.
-::: About avoiding mass uploaded images, the script could skip filenames ending in "_map.png" and "_title.png" to save processing time indeed. Or what (else) did you have in mind?
-::: Do you now want to launch a general discussion before I continue? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 05:41, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
-::: I added the main space data. Okay, yes, it's voluminous. :) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:51, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+== Speedy delete vs unused images ==
-:::: There's so much progress here, people can't help being inspired to further suggestions!&nbsp; :>&nbsp;&nbsp; I hope you won't interpret it as criticism if I make suggestions before testing any bibliographic edits &mdash; it's a big job and I don't want people to have to revert me later.
+As far as I'm aware unused image deletion isn't actually covered under any of the speedy delete criteria. Criteria 15 is specifically to allow for maintenance tasks like category and article (especially redirect) moves which do not result in any meaningful difference in site content. However it's going to be uncontroversial in a case like the one being referred to here and similar deletes weren't previously subjected to any prolonged discussion, so we can let it slide as far as making any unnecessary edits is concerned. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 16:01, 2 September 2022 (CDT)
+:True, I picked 15 because a more specific type for unused, poor quality images wasn't available, and because I indeed expected these deletes to be uncontroversial. Wasn't aware 15 is intended for more limited cases. Anyway, I already added a bunch more Hacx images to [[:Category:Speedy_delete|the category]] two days ago, so if you feel like finishing them off quickly, I have no objections. :) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:44, 2 September 2022 (CDT)
-:::: Regarding ''mass uploaded images'', you have apparently handled this, by counting links in template space once per template instead of once per transclusion.
+== Titlepic upscaling ==
-:::: You're probably correct to parse wikitext instead of HTML; it provides more fine-grained results.&nbsp; Note that:
+I notices that you put "scaled up to correct aspect ratio" under any titlepic you upload. I wondered whether this is historically true. Didn't Doom run correct at 320x200? I thought this was the native resolution or at least correct aspect ratio for most monitors back then.
-::::* {{c|<nowiki>[[wiki:</nowiki>}} also points to Wikipedia.
-::::* I'm a regex newbie, but the above doesn't seem to include MediaWiki's case insensitivity on the first character.&nbsp; E.g. {{c|<nowiki>{{wp</nowiki>}} and {{c|<nowiki>{{Wp</nowiki>}} are the same.&nbsp; {{wp|fair use}} and {{wp|Fair use}} are the same.&nbsp; Further, interwiki prefixes are [[wIKIpEDia:Help:Interwiki linking#Project titles and shortcuts|completely case-insensitive]].
-::::* Similarly, {{wp|Blake Stone: Aliens of Gold}} and {{wp|Blake_Stone:_Aliens_of_Gold}} are the same.
-::::* I endorse Gez's idea of a third column: direct links are far more likely to be unmarked sources, at least on the articles I've seen.
-:::: If the consensus is not to filter mainspace links (time for that general discussion&nbsp; :D&nbsp;)&nbsp; then there will be many more ideas and many more possible mass edits to implement them.&nbsp; I personally still intend to focus on the task in the OP, and would heuristically skip entries clearly outside it ({{wp|Blu-Ray}}, {{wp|Lava}}).&nbsp; If no one else made use of the remainder, then anything I missed would simply remand to a more general link rot project in the far future.
+Another thing I wanted to ask: how do you upscale your extracted titlepic lumps? Because i can see yours end up significantly smaller in size than mine. I just upscale them with paint and end up with 200-300 KB. I know this is a super beginner question but i'm curious how i can get similar small file sizes. --[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 19:02, 26 November 2022 (CST)
+:Doom ran at 320x200 but in a 4:3 aspect, not a 8:5 aspect. We have a whole article on [[aspect ratio]]; just read it. As for the proper way to rescale, do not use Paint. Personally I use Gimp, with a two-step process: first rescale to 1600x1200 with no interpolation, then scale down to 640x480 with interpolation. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 07:54, 27 November 2022 (CST)
+:Was about to point the aspect ratio article too. As a Linux person, I naturally use a script to quickly rescale, so the efficiency is due to the GD/libpng libraries:
+<pre>
+#!/usr/bin/php
+<?php
+	// rescale titlepic.png from 320x200 to 640x480
+	if ($argc != 2 || !is_file($argv[1])) {
+		echo "Usage: {$argv[0]} <titlepic.png>\n";
+		exit(1);
+	}
+	$file = $argv[1];
+	$file2 = str_replace('.png', '-2.png', $file);
+	list($width, $height) = getimagesize($file);
+	$w = 640; $h = 480;
+	$src = imagecreatefrompng($file);
+	$dst = imagecreatetruecolor($w, $h);
+	imagecopyresampled($dst, $src, 0, 0, 0, 0, $w, $h, $width, $height);
+	imagepng($dst, $file2, 9);
+?>
+</pre>
+: For your [[:File:Jumpwad title.png]] of 110KB, I got 48KB, and for [[:File:Nostalgia title.png]] of 132KB, I got 50KB. For 800x600 in-game shots, the savings would indeed be more significant. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 08:03, 27 November 2022 (CST)
+:: That article was an interesting read. Interesting indeed. I'm on windows, so i guess i'll try gimp and see how that changes things. Thanks for the advice to you both. --[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 14:13, 27 November 2022 (CST)
-:::: Hope that makes some sense, and thanks as always for your patience.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 19:56, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+=="use local wl for Bethesda, fix grammar"==
+. That's the wrong Bethesda, there's a reason I didn't use it to begin with. Bethesda Softworks is the parent company/publisher. Bethesda Game Studios is the company that makes Fallout. The two have never been the same thing.<br>
+. Did you not see our discussion regarding the Fallout wiki opening in 3 days (from when the post was made)? I don't think reverting all that work is worthwhile under that kind of timeframe if that's your only objection.
+--[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 11:27, 30 December 2022 (CST)
-Hey, a suggestion: would it be possible to have a third column listing the link types used? More generally, a bot capable of looking through the wiki pages to find any and all instance of direct links to domains that have interwiki entries would be useful for maintenance. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 06:25, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+: I moved/merged the thread, so... yes I read it. :) BGS is [[Bethesda Softworks#History|mentioned]] on our Bethesda Softworks article so I figured it was close enough (even considered making Bethesda Game Studios redirect to it, but now... maybe not). But I changed the sentence primarily because the old style looked like a run-on phrase (lacking a possessive apostrophe, at least). Would be okay with reverting to the wp we had before.
+: I didn't change any FO/related links indeed because of their wiki opening soon, and reverted only the Elder Scrolls link because it was now [https://en.uesp.net/wiki/The_Elder_Scrolls_V:_Skyrim broken]. Generally I am okay with using FO wiki links for FO topics, but am not convinced about doing that for general company links like Bethesda. Hope that addresses your concerns? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:59, 30 December 2022 (CST)
-: Sure, you mean whether a DW page uses wp template, interwiki or https link for a WP link? How should the third column look like, for example? And what if more than one method is used for the same WP link on a page?
+:: I don't consider our Bethesda article to be about BGS or sufficient for its coverage. Nor should it be made so, as BGS is not even relevant to Doom. So I don't have any issue having BGS links specifically going to another wiki, and would prefer that they do so, whether it's to wp or falloutwiki. Links referring to Bethesda ''Softworks'' should stay pointing to our local Bethesda ''Softworks'' article. If someone isn't sure which is which in some context, it's no different than any other incorrect wiki link being made.
-: The general suggestion would be a separate bot script. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:42, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
-::I figure the third column could just contain a simple marker, like D for direct link, I for interwiki link, and T and template link. If more than one method is used, then you get more than one marker. If there's a direct link and a template link, then it'd show DT for example. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 07:03, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
-&larr;&larr;&larr;
+:: It looks like for some reason the UESP article has moved to Skyrim:Skyrim on their end. I don't even see a move in the page history so I don't know how or when that happened. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 15:22, 30 December 2022 (CST)
+::: I reverted to wp, but only now see that the apostrophe was lost in [[Special:Diff/369059|Kid's edit]]. Anyway, I'll stay out of it and leave remaining edits and approvals to you. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 15:32, 30 December 2022 (CST)
-First, to clear up a misconception, bot scripts aren't crawling the site's HTML pages. They communicate via the [[mediawikiwiki:API:Main page|MW API]] and thus, when working with page content, they indeed retrieve and store wikitext, just like a human using the edit form. And in the Template namespace, fetching pages therefore gets the template wikitext; nothing transcluded. I wouldn't even ''want'' to process HTML for page content, that would be error-prone and unnecessarily complicated.
+== Changing the year of release for DMP series ==
-Thanks for the feedback, the interwiki pattern was updated to '{{c|<nowiki>\[\[Wiki(?:pedia)?:(.+?)(?:\|.+?)?\]\]</nowiki>}}'. All patterns are matched using the [http://www.php.net/manual/en/reference.pcre.pattern.modifiers.php ''i'' modifier], so case-insensitively. But the WP paths ''found'' are case-sensitive, and stored that way in the data structure. The script doesn't know which one of those is the canonical WP page. To collate WP paths to some degree, the script now converts all underscores to spaces, to deal with Blake_Stone-type situations. But I'm not sure no WP path legitimately includes an underscore, and whether that would result in a broken WP link in the first column of the tables.
+Hello! I am now in the process of cleaning Doomworld Mega Project articles and one big thing that I see is that most of this articles have wrong year of release listed. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the release date is the date when the first version of the wad was released somewhere (at DW forums for example) even if it is a beta version. If so, could you please use your bot to move maps and wads in individual pages for participants of these collaborations from one year to another? I hate to do it manually. I will notice you when I'm done. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 16:23, 18 March 2023 (CDT)
+: For that series, see [[User talk:Eris Falling#Release year|the exception]]. For a better understanding of my bot account, {{dwforumsp|2600590|see here}}. In other words, it cannot be given arbitrary instructions, it just executes API commands issued by [[User:XymphBot#.ini scripts|scripts]]. And it's not feasible to write one for this situation, even we were to agree on changing the aforementioned release year exception. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 18:52, 18 March 2023 (CDT)
+:: <s>That's very strange. Is there any way to make such hidden exception a part of the rules? How should anyone became aware that such exceptions even exist before making an edit? Maybe I should open a discussion at Central Processing?</s> Nevermind, I've created [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing#The year of release for projects that have a year in the name|a topic]] at Central Processing. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 01:11, 19 March 2023 (CDT)
-Also, paths starting with a letter always use a capital initial in WP's URL, so the first letter is now uppercased to collate [Ff]air use-type situations. But I can't safely collate "Alice in Chains" and "Alice In Chains", so in those situations there are still multiple entries. Further, in File space, pages ending in " map.png" were skipped, saving about half an hour of processing time.
+== Pyroscourge's name ==
-Lastly, the third column is present, showing very few direct links, most of which I fixed already. No DW pages mixed link types for the same WP path, either. After the following log:
+Hello! By looking through Winter's Fury 2016.5 version wad (which has a lot of development commentary) I found out Pyroscourge's real name. It is clearly shown in commentary in DECORATE and not specially hidden. The question is - can I use this info right away or should I go to Doomworld and PM them, asking permission first? I didn't find some guideline about personal data in rules, but I don't want to make people uncomfortable. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 14:22, 22 March 2023 (CDT)
+: If it's only buried in an old release (not even in the most recent) and not plainly documented in readme/credits files, then it seems to me it wasn't the author's intention to make their name all that public. But I suppose you could ask if they don't mind. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 15:44, 22 March 2023 (CDT)
- Attempting to log in... Success.
+== Episode or multilevel WAD ==
- collecting Wikipedia namespaces:  34
- processing 'main'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Counterattack... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:E1M3:_Toxin_Refinery_(Phobos_Revisited)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:E4M9:_Bean_Oversight_(Doom_the_Way_id_Did:_The_Lost_Episodes)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:IRC... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP02:_Security_(H2H-Xmas)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP06:_Colossus_(The_Rebirth)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP10:_Eureka_Signs_(BTSX-E2)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP15:_Descent_to_Core_(Speed_of_Doom)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP21:_Aberinkula_(MAYhem_2048)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP27:_Emerald_Spire_(Sunlust)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP34:_Abstraction_(Claustrophobia_1024_2)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Psychophobia... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:The_Doom_Movement_Bible... 100 200 300
- processed:  6874 pages
- processing 'Doom Wiki'...
- processed:    43 pages
- processing 'File'... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:32in24_MAP09_hilltop.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:AnimFace.gif... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Cchest4_MAP13.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:CommunityChest-map12-mud.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Congestion1024-map19-end.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:DTWID-LE_E2M8_map.png... 100 200
- processing 'File' from File:Doom3_weapons_07.jpg... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Doom_v0.3_thestore.png... 100 200 300 400
- processing 'File' from File:E3M4_map.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Eternity-e2m1-s.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:H2H-Xmas_MAP31_map.png... 100 200
- processing 'File' from File:Heretic-e3m4-snail.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Interception_MAP04_map.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Kansams_Trial_E2M7_map.png... 100 200
- processing 'File' from File:MM_MAP02_Secret.png... 100 200 300 400
- processing 'File' from File:MementoMori2-map04-down.png... 100 200 300 400
- processing 'File' from File:NDCP-map23-torches.png... 100 200
- processing 'File' from File:Origwad_2.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Psx-command-control-start.png... 100 200 300 400
- processing 'File' from File:Requiem-map27-end.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Scythe2_MAP03_map.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Stardate20X6.png... 100 200
- processing 'File' from File:TheEvilUnleashed-e3m5-cage.png... 100 200 300
- processing 'File' from File:Vile_Flesh_MAP11_map.png... 100
- processed: 12260 pages
- skipped:    3465 map pages
- processing 'Template'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Template' from Template:MAYhem_1500_21-30... 100 200 300 400
- processed:   940 pages
- processing 'Help'...
- processed:     8 pages
- processing 'Category'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:Easter_eggs... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:MrGuyTodd_levels... 100 200 300 400
- processed:  1491 pages
-the new tables for all DW namespaces are online. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:58, 28 March 2018 (CDT)
+Hello! I want to discuss [[Special:Diff/387016|this edit]], not for the sake of this paricular WAD, but for my future edits. IMO "Shadows of Chronos" is an episode WAD, because it is equal to a standard Hexen episode - has a hub and 5 levels around it. I thought that multilevel WADs category is for mappacks, that have unconnected maps, like smaller DMPs (fewer levels than megawad). Or am I wrong and only Doom mods can have episode WADs? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 09:05, 8 April 2023 (CDT)
+: Normally the threshold of multilevel sets is up to 6 maps; 7 is close enough to 8-9 to be an episode. But I hadn't realized this is Hexen, and I suppose a hub-set can also be tagged as an episode. Btw, the map list doesn't mark which one is the hub, that would be useful information. Edit: it then makes sense if intros of the pertaining map pages mention the same info. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 10:32, 8 April 2023 (CDT)
+::Done! Is it okay this way? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 13:38, 8 April 2023 (CDT)
+::: Sure. It's simply the same deal as music: WAD overview page and individual map pages should be consistent with each other. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 13:58, 8 April 2023 (CDT)
-: Thank you!&nbsp; I'm slightly out of breath, watching it grow.&nbsp; :>&nbsp;&nbsp; Maybe I spend too much time thinking about the global topology of the wiki, but I sense this could lead in several useful directions, not all to do with modifying links.
+== DBP mapper page edits ==
+I'm going through and adding all the WADs first. For your own sanity, it might be best to hold off on the individual page edits until I finish and just do them all in one go. --[[User:Matador|Matador]] ([[User talk:Matador|talk]]) 02:14, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
+: [[User_talk:Nockson#DBPs|See here]], the bulk of WAD links are done via [[Special:Contributions/XymphBot|bot script]], one path at a time. There were just a few links to the series article that needed manual massaging. ''Edit'': pregreplGen.php saved the day here too, in all but one case. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:17, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
-: ''They communicate via the [[mediawikiwiki:API:Main page|MW API]]''&nbsp;&nbsp; &mdash;&nbsp;I did know that, and in that very documentation I kept seeing mentions of [[mw:API:Parsing wikitext|"parsed" text]].&nbsp; I hoped there was a feature which could make your task easier by reducing the number of different cases to search for, i.e. [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia&action=render converting all links into direct links].&nbsp; Of course I accept your word that wikitext is easier; as I said, in hindsight that should be easier for everyone else also.
+== Date of release ==
-: ''But I'm not sure no WP path legitimately includes an underscore''&nbsp;&nbsp; &mdash;&nbsp;I'm reasonably sure, based on [[Category talk:D＿GARG levels|this experiment]], that equivalence between spaces and underscores is implemented at a fairly low level.&nbsp; I can even type the spaces into my URL bar and still get where I intended: {{c|<nowiki>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death of Michael Jackson</nowiki>}}&nbsp;&nbsp; Does that work in general?&nbsp; Nope: {{c|<nowiki>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxqaI c9j g</nowiki>}}
+Hi! Got another question: what {{wp|time zone}} should be taken into account when filling in the release date of mods? GMT? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 08:59, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
+: No idea. It normally doesn't make that much difference anyway. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 09:07, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
+:: Example: [[User:Matador|Matador]] wrote in today's [[DBP57: Shatter Realm]] article that it was released on March 1, but it is actually March 2 (03:34 GMT). Some of the DBPs have the same issue. Should I fix it or leave at that? I ask because in my two DBP pages I've used the Moscow time (GMT+3). --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 09:12, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
-: ''But I can't safely collate "Alice in Chains" and "Alice In Chains"''&nbsp;&nbsp; &mdash;&nbsp;True enough.&nbsp; So far none of these points is enormously important&nbsp; :D&nbsp; however:
+::: For spelling we generally [[Doom Wiki:Policies and guidelines#Spelling|use US English]] due to id being an American company, but also allow Standard English in specific situations. So perhaps we can apply something similar towards time zones, i.e. if a release initially happened in USA or Europe, use that time zone. But again, I dunno... perhaps a long-standing admin can advice? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 09:28, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
+:::: Got your point. Because Doomer Boards is mostly US website I will use US time. And we also have now 56 DBP pages that all use US time. <s>Gonna fix my two articles then.</s> (edit: dates are OK) Thanks! --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 09:36, 12 April 2023 (CDT)
-: ''Thanks for the feedback''&nbsp;&nbsp; &mdash;&nbsp;It's the least I can do.&nbsp; Something is still wrong, because the table omits the link that started my train of thought: [[E1M4: Command Control (Doom)#Sources|this one]].
+== Nicknames ==
-: [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 18:12, 28 March 2018 (CDT)
+Hello! Sorry, but I need to bother you again. When certain content creator has different nicknames, which of them should I put into for example a map article: 1) a direct link to their wiki page which uses another nickname; OR 2) redirect but with an actual nickname? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 15:04, 14 April 2023 (CDT)
+: Both are in use, particularly when someone changes alias while articles and links already exist. The main thing about WAD overviews is to use the canonical path for mappers (optionally with a different link text) so that when I create the .ini file (and from that map articles), they get the correct link and author category. Keeping mapper categories consistent and unduplicated is a PITA with all these alias changes over the years, and with inconsistent spelling/casing in project documentation. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:51, 14 April 2023 (CDT)
-:: Ow, that's because [[Template:Wikipedia]] wasn't mentioned to far, and I didn't realize it either. It's now covered by regex '{{c|<nowiki>{{wikipedia(?:\|(?:title=)?(.+?)(?:\|.+?)?)?}}</nowiki>}}' and type S (Source). Besides with a positional or named parameter, it can be used parameterless which presented a small problem, but that's now solved. See the updated list. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 10:58, 29 March 2018 (CDT)
+== myhouse ==
-::: D'oh!&nbsp; I saw "exception list" above, and somehow assumed it was part of the regex even though I couldn't see it.&nbsp; (I did page through templates at some point to check if there were any more.&nbsp; There are not.)
+Has the myhouse article been locked in some form? Or were my editing rights revoked?? When i rejected an edit just now, it didn't autocheck but instead added it to the list of pending review until you checked it. ----[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 16:22, 28 April 2023 (CDT)
+: Not that I'm aware of. Earlier edits had not yet been accepted, so I think you may have forgotten to tick the 'Accept this version' checkbox when doing that revert. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:38, 28 April 2023 (CDT)
+:: Yeah, that was probaly it. Thanx ----[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 16:53, 28 April 2023 (CDT)
-::: I think that's all of my questions, so we'll see what others have to say.&nbsp; :>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 16:36, 29 March 2018 (CDT)
+== Column gap  ==
-== Interwiki links ==
+What is the reason why i can't use wider gaps than 5em when it causes line wrapping? I personally think it looks very ugly to the eye when a list has a line wrap around like this. It can easily be remedied by increasing the gap a little. Doesn't look any worse on mobile either way. So why keep that flaw? Is there a technical reason for this or is it just the "standard way" of doing things (which i don't see by itself to be a good enough reason to not correct an visual flaw)? In other words: i'd like to use it this way, if it doesn't cause any issues with formatting, why can't i?   ----[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 13:10, 3 May 2023 (CDT)
-''Copied from Wikipedia topic'':<br/>
+: Because your PC, full-screen browser, and 21:9 monitor are not the measure of the wiki's layout. And a factor 3 increase is not "a little." Pages need to render (reasonably) well on a wide variety of screens, including landscape and portrait mobile devices and non-full-screen windows. The wide gap wastes a lot of space on narrower page layouts, causing the map and soundtrack columns to get crammed into a third of the body width with a huge white area in between. Personally I do consider that an ugly layout. The 5em gap layout was developed years ago by Quasar and has served us well since. Line wraps are common with long(er) map titles and extensive soundtrack credits, I don't mind them much, and it is more important that both columns are roughly equally long (that is why we play with the first column's width), and soundtrack rows align approximately with map names. And that alignment is also visually hampered by a very wide gap. But no matter how wide the gap and the first column, page layouts will vary somewhat across screens and devices. So, let's just stick to the standard as IMO it's the best compromise. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 15:25, 3 May 2023 (CDT)
-More generally, a bot capable of looking through the wiki pages to find any and all instance of direct links to domains that have interwiki entries would be useful for maintenance. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 06:25, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+:: Actually I rarely set my browser to full-screen nor do i have a 21:9 monitor... but i get your point. I still think that just because it's the default way of doing something and on most occasions also the correct one, means it has to be followed religiously for every situation. What is considered visually displeasing or ugly is of course very much a matter of personal taste. But speaking about compromise - if i do understand you correctly the first column's width can be adjusted. So in this case i would then increase the column's width to 40% to alleviate the problem. Is that ok? ----[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 16:25, 3 May 2023 (CDT)
+::: Yeah, I was exaggerating. ;-) The big white gap between columns would always be a problem because it leaves less width for information. So it in fact results in ''more'' line wrapping in the soundtrack column. To reduce wrapping in the maps column, tweaking its width as always been the normal approach, not widening the gap. So yes, you can increase it a little bit, but as said the idea remains to keep both columns roughly equally high across a reasonable range of screen/window widths. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 07:07, 4 May 2023 (CDT)
-: To verify, this script needs to search pages for the URLs in the [[Special:Interwiki|Interwiki table]] (up to the $1 parameter), and show which interwiki prefix should be used instead? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:26, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+== Soulcrusher ==
-::Yeah, I figure that should be enough. The only potential subtlety would be to watch out for http/https, i.e. there could be an http direct link to a site that has https in the interwiki table (or vice-versa). --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 13:42, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
-: If we're talking about maintenance, the reverse of this (an analogue of [[Special:LinkSearch]] for interwikis only) would occasionally be useful as well, e.g. when a site goes down permanently.&nbsp; Again a low priority, unless someone finds a live example.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 20:00, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+Hello! I'm making articles for Caco RUps, yesterday I've made a page for [[Soulcrusher]], which I'm currently editing. And my God, this mod is a mess. There are some levels inside the WAD that can't be reached inside the game, its MAPINFO contains levels that don't even exist, and for some reason I can't get past the cutscenes to check some of the levels (controls doesn't work). Anyway, I suggest to not make individual map pages for the mod. I surely don't have patience to check playability of all its levels. Maybe someone else could do it, but I'm not sure it is worth it. I wanna finish with its soundtrack and move on, let it stay as a stub for a while. What do you think? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 12:18, 4 May 2023 (CDT)
+: Works for me, then unlink the maps and we leave it at that. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:37, 4 May 2023 (CDT)
-:: Not sure what info a "reverse" script (or addition to the current script) should generate &ndash; if you'd like something done, please elaborate.
+== Cacowards links ==
-:: The current script was pretty easy to derive from the previous one, and produces the [[User:Xymph/List of Interwiki links|latest table]] after this log:
- Attempting to log in... Success.
+Had a little issue today scrolling through Cacowards pages to plan my future work. A few weeks ago you [[Special:Diff/388408|reverted my edit]] on Caco2021, where I've updated DWF links to IG. But I see that you did the same thing via your bot [[Special:Diff/386824|HERE]] and [[Special:Diff/266534|HERE]], for example. What's the difference? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 15:58, 4 May 2023 (CDT)
- collecting unique Interwiki list: 135
+: That's more like semi-automatic "collateral damage" of updating links on mapper pages - I could have skipped them but didn't <shrug>. The Cacoward pages use the links as published in the original articles, so there's no need to explicitly edit them for the sake of ig-ifying everything everywhere. I could have ''not'' reverted that edit, but just happened to do it in the spur of the moment <shrug>. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:02, 5 May 2023 (CDT)
- processing 'main'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Counterattack... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:E1M3:_Toxin_Refinery_(Phobos_Revisited)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:E4M9:_Bean_Oversight_(Doom_the_Way_id_Did:_The_Lost_Episodes)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:IRC... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP02:_Security_(H2H-Xmas)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP06:_Colossus_(The_Rebirth)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP10:_Eureka_Signs_(BTSX-E2)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP15:_Descent_to_Core_(Speed_of_Doom)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP21:_Aberinkula_(MAYhem_2048)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP27:_Emerald_Spire_(Sunlust)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP34:_Abstraction_(Claustrophobia_1024_2)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Psychophobia... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:The_Doom_Movement_Bible... 100 200 300
- processed:  6874 pages
- processing 'Doom Wiki'...
- processed:    43 pages
- processing 'File'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:32in24_MAP09_hilltop.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:AnimFace.gif... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Cchest4_MAP13.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:CommunityChest-map12-mud.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Congestion1024-map19-end.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:DTWID-LE_E2M8_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Doom3_weapons_07.jpg... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Doom_v0.3_thestore.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:E3M4_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Eternity-e2m1-s.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:H2H-Xmas_MAP31_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Heretic-e3m4-secret.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Interception_MAP03_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Kansams_Trial_E2M6_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:MM_MAP01_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:MementoMori2-map03-plus.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:NDCP-map19-water.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Odessa_3.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Psx-central-processing-02.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Requiem-map22-cacos.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Scythe2-map28-afrit.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Speed_of_Doom_MAP24_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:TheEvilUnleashed-e3m1-chasm.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Vanguard_MAP06_map.png... 100 200
- processed: 12292 pages
- processing 'Template'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Template' from Template:MAYhem_1500_21-30... 100 200 300 400
- processed:   940 pages
- processing 'Help'...
- processed:     8 pages
- processing 'Category'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:Easter_eggs... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:MrGuyTodd_levels... 100 200 300 400
- processed:  1491 pages
-:: Some info about what listInterLinks.php does:
+== Two questions about redirects ==
-::* init namespace lists and patterns; DW paths in the exception list are the previous five, plus '{{c|Doom Wiki:Departure from Wikia}}', '{{c|Doom Wiki:Source material}}' and '{{c|Help:Special pages}}'
-::* the interwiki list is [https://doomwiki.org/w/api.php?action=query&meta=siteinfo&siprop=interwikimap fetched] and the URLs are converted to regexes, e.g. the first one becomes "{{c|<nowiki>https?://3dfxdev\.net/edgewiki/index\.php\?title=[\w#%/:.=-]+</nowiki>}}"; also, some interwikis/URLs occur in the list twice, so it is deduped from 157 to 135
-::* pages are fetched from namespaces analog to listWikilinks and matches for each regex are stored in an array (keyed by interwiki prefix) of arrays (keyed by DW path)
-::* the arrays are then sorted by those keys &ndash; but the direct links remain stored in the order they were encountered in that page &ndash; and the table is generated
-:: On the first full pass, file pages ending in " map.png" weren't skipped yet but that's enabled now to save time in future runs. If more/different features are needed, let me know. For one thing, the {{c|<nowiki>$1</nowiki>}} regex was a bit limited, I've already expanded it to "{{c|<nowiki>[\w#@%&/?!:;,.~=+-]+</nowiki>}}". --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 04:50, 3 April 2018 (CDT)
-== Templatable links ==
+Hello! I know that these are probably minor things, but I still need to ask you two questions:
-''Moved from Wikipedia topic'':<br/>
+) In the "Appearance statistics" sections for weapons, items, monsters etc you use redirects instead of proper links to maps and even IWADs ("Plutonia Experiment" and "Ultimate Doom" both without "The"). Is this intentional?
-And while I'm on that general topic, a third script could search for direct links that could be templated -- I'm thinking about stuff like direct links to forums or archives, [[:Category:External link templates|notably]]. There's no hurry, though. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 07:03, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+) Overview articles for Doom II, Evilution and Plutonia uses "Level XX" phrases over the usual MAPXX links. I looked through these pages history and see that this is intentional, probably because vanilla Doom shows "Level XX" on the automap. And that's the reason why redirects with "Level XX" exist. However such redirects exist only for Doom II and a few maps from Final Doom. Should I create redirects of this type for all other Final Doom maps?
+Thanks in advance! --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 16:35, 16 June 2023 (CDT)
-: Okay, one thing are a time. :) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:26, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+: 1. Yes. That's how they're programmed into DMMPST. 2. Right. No, if they weren't needed early on in the wiki's life, they're not needed anymore.<br>General note 1: redirects are not evil, it is not essential to avoid them at extreme effort. Among other purposes like easier search results, they're a convenience tool for writing naturally flowing texts without insisting on writing <nowiki>[[link|text]]</nowiki> all the time. So you can use it, but it's okay ''not'' to use that link structure and keep the redirect. From that follows that editing articles ''solely'' to change redirects into direct links, is not functional and just clutters Recent Changes. If there's another, ''functional'' reason to edit an article and you feel like avoiding a redirect, then there's little harm, especially when changing a plural redirect into a pluralized links (e.g. [[rocket]]s for [[rockets]]). But otherwise, just be more relaxed about redirects.<br>General note 2: empty lines below section headers are also not evil, it is not essential to avoid them at extreme effort, either. [[Special:Diff/398504|Edits]] [[Special:Diff/398613|like]] [[Special:Diff/398524|these]] are not functional and again just clutter Recent Changes. I didn't stop you in your tracks because to some degree I understand the desire for consistency when changing these in related articles that ''did'' get functional changes. But really, don't you have better things to do? ;-) Especially between header and prettytable (like in Data sections), an empty line makes the header stand out a bit better. And empty lines above big collapsible navboxes in page footers have a layout purpose, so should be restored. But not the others, what's done is done.<br> General advice: often it's better to leave well enough alone, until polishing it can be combined with an update that actually matters. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:46, 17 June 2023 (CDT)
-: This one should be uncontroversial, but "no hurry" is an understatement.&nbsp; :>&nbsp;&nbsp; IMO a bot performing style edits would have to sweep at regular intervals, and I don't assume Xymph or anyone else can commit to that (wishful thinking solution: someone in the Doom community figures out how to host bots as autonomous processes, like the WMF does).&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 17:04, 27 March 2018 (CDT)
+== deleting my wiki page? ==
-:: Actually, running scripts regularly and posting their output to list pages automatically would be trivial for me, and less so for anyone else. ;-) But multiple admins/editors are monitoring Recent Changes already and when incorrect styles and links are fixed right away, regular runs won't even be necessary. An incidental run every 4-6 months or so would be enough to catch anything falling through those cracks.
+i saw you nominated some page i made for speedy deletion. It was a sprite from the original doom which serves as a switch. Could you tell me what is wrong so i can fix it?
-:: The new script was really easy to derive from the previous one, and produces the [[User:Xymph/List of templatable links|latest table]] after this log:
+--[[User:--unknown--|Hey guys, i&#39;m new to doom wiki and I am here to add some good wads, textures in doom, and more! I have an actual username on other places, but not here. Doom Is Eternal]] ([[User talk:--unknown--|talk]]) 14:23, 18 June 2023 (CDT)
- Attempting to log in... Success.
+: Hi, the reason for the nomination is in the edit summary: "topic covered in [[switch]], a specific focus on one mod is not needed". You can see the summary with the [[Special:Diff/398763|diff]], in the [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Gargoyle_Switch&action=history page history], and in [[Special:RecentChanges|Recent Changes]]. For every wiki user, newcomers especially, it is recommended to keep an eye on Recent Changes how your contributions are reviewed and (possibly) edited, and learn from that.
- collecting external templates list: 20
+: Regarding your [[User talk:XymphBot#deleting another page|other question]]: your WAD fan post was not deleted but moved to your user area as [[User:--unknown--/Stanley.wad|a sandbox]] for possible further editing. This move was also logged in Recent Changes. The resulting redirect from main space to user space then had to be deleted. If and when the fan post evolves into an article that meets wiki standards, then it can be moved back. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:53, 19 June 2023 (CDT)
+:: cool, thanks {{unsigned|--unknown--}}
- processing 'main'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Cory_Scott_(NiTROACTiVE)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:E1M3:_The_Gatehouse_(Heretic)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:E4M5:_The_Witching_Hour_(Crusades)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Hub_4:_Desolate_Garden... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP02:_Nullth_Precinct_(Community_Chest)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP05:_Wasted!_(NDCP2)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP09_(2_Sectors)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP14:_Vile_Gear_(Swift_Death)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP20:_Speedtraps_for_the_Bee_Kingdom_(BTSX-E2)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP26:_Teleport_Control_(Daedalus:_Alien_Defense)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:MAP32:_Ultimative_Geheimnis_(Whispers_of_Satan)... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Porkalator... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'main' from main:Terminatrix... 100 200 300 400
- processed:  6916 pages
- processing 'Doom Wiki'...
- processed:    43 pages
- processing 'File'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:32in24_MAP09_hilltop.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:AnimFace.gif... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Cchest4_MAP12_Deathmatch.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:CommunityChest-map12-end.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Congestion1024-map17-switches.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:DTWID-LE_E2M1_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Doom3_backpack.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Doom_pinky_2.jpg... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:E3M1_heretic.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Eternally_Yours_MAP12_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:H2H-Xmas_MAP24_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Heretic-e3m1-storage.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Infinity_E1M8_Map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:KansamsTrial-E2M7-start.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:MM8BDM_Gameplay_1.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:MementoMori2-map01-start.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:NDCP-map17-hex.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Obituary_MAP04_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Programador1_Strife.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Requiem-map16-elemental.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Scythe2-map13-center.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:SpeedOfDoom-map28-redskullkey.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Talosian_Incident_MAP15_map.png... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'File' from File:Vae_Victus_2_MAP02_map.png... 100 200 300
- processed: 12341 pages
- processing 'Help'...
- processed:     8 pages
- processing 'Category'... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:Earth_(WAD)_levels... 100 200 300 400 500
- processing 'Category' from Category:MrGlide_levels... 100 200 300 400
- processed:  1493 pages
-:: Some info about what listExternLinks.php does:
+== Wad template usage ==
-::* init namespace lists and patterns; pages in the exception list are just '{{c|Doom Wiki:Central Processing.*}}' and '{{c|Help:Spam/Archive}}'
-::* from [[:Category:External link templates|External link templates]] the following were manually added to the patterns list (the others don't contain direct links):
- $externlist['Competnftp'] = 'https?://(?:www\.)?doom\.com\.hr/temp/compet-n/';
+I disagree with the usage of the wad template for the [[Voxel Doom]] page. When there's a titlepic or at least a title menu where a screenshot can be taken from (like i did for [[SRB2]]), it makes sense to use it. But in the case of Voxel Doom neither of these approaches work. The mod doesn't have a title of any sorts and simply adding a random in-game screenshot isn't the right approach here, since the in-game looks very much like vanilla Doom because the whole purpose of voxel monsters is that they look just like vanilla 2D if viewed straight. As a result a screenshot is unlikely to ever be added.
- $externlist['Competnmap'] = 'https?://(?:www\.)?doom\.com\.hr/index.php\?page=compet-n_database&cndb=';
- $externlist['Competnwad'] = 'https?://(?:www\.)?doom\.com\.hr/index.php\?page=compet-n_database&wad_id=';
- $externlist['Deb-pkg']    = 'https?://packages\.debian\.org/';
- $externlist['Drdforums']  = 'https?://forum\.drdteam\.org/viewtopic.php\?';
- $externlist['Dsda']       = 'https?://doomedsda\.us/wad';
- $externlist['Dsdaftp']    = 'https?://doomedsda\.us/lmps/';
- $externlist['Dwforums']   = 'https?://(?:www\.)?doomworld\.com/vb/thread/';
- $externlist['Dwforumst']  = 'https?://(?:www\.)?doomworld\.com/vb/post/';
- $externlist['Edgeeg']     = 'https?://edge\.sourceforge\.net/edit_guide/';
- $externlist['Idftp']      = 'https?://mirrors\.syringanetworks\.net/idgames/';
- $externlist['Idgames']    = 'https?://(?:www\.)?doomworld\.com/idgames/';
- $externlist['Idgamesmm']  = '<nowiki>ftp://ftp\.fu-berlin\.de/pc/msdos/games/idgames/</nowiki>';
- $externlist['Lc']         = 'https?://lccn\.loc\.gov/';
- $externlist['Legacywiki'] = 'https?://legacywiki\.net/index\.php/';
- $externlist['Realm667']   = 'https?://(?:www\.)?realm667\.com/index\.php\?option=com_content&view=';
- $externlist['Vvwiki']     = 'https?://(?:www\.)?vavoom-engine\.com/wiki/index.php\?title=';
- $externlist['Wip']        = 'https?://(?:www\.)?wadsinprogress\.info/\?a=listwads&wad=';
- $externlist['Zanforums']  = 'https?://(?:www\.)?zandronum\.com/forum/showthread\.php\?tid=';
- $externlist['Zdforums']   = 'https?://forum\.zdoom\.org/viewtopic\.php\?';
-::* pages are fetched from namespaces analog to listInterlinks and matches for each regex are stored in an array (keyed by external template) of arrays (keyed by DW path); sorting and outputting remained the same
+So i'd argue 'this' is very much one of those situations where the wad template is not applicable since the screenshot window can't be removed and leaving it permanently empty looks rather ugly. So not using it solves the problem. Which is why i didn't. And you also seemed to be ok with this since you didn't correct it initially. There are also plenty of examples of gameplay mod page that do the same thing, so seems to be common practice for these kind of situations. --[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 10:22, 20 June 2023 (CDT)
-:: On the initial pass, templates being matched by their own template's link were skipped, but because some direct links occur in multiple templates a handful of them were still included as false positives. So for the full run over all namespaces, Template space was skipped.
+: Appearances that I am on top of everything, everywhere, all at once, can be deceiving. :-) There are many reasons why I don't initially edit an edit: too busy with something else (on-wiki, off-wiki, IRL), waiting for another editor to address something first, not thinking of an alternative approach until the next day, etc.
-:: For future runs, '{{c|Idgames archive}}' is added to the exception list as direct links do belong on that page. As usual, file pages ending in " map.png" will also be skipped.
+: Using the wad template is better because it nicely organizes information in the top-right corner and generates cats automatically. That is its primary purpose, the image is optional. Just because you think the screenshot invitation message looks "rather ugly" is not a good enough reason not use the template, IMHO. Other [[Guncaster|gameplay]] [[Supercharge (mod)|mods]] don't have a screenshot either (yet?), but the template still serves its main purpose. Various other gameplay mods don't use the template, and maybe for a better reason than not having an appropriate image. So that doesn't mean someone should now go overboard on adding it everywhere, it depends on individual circumstances. Plenty level WADs don't have a screenshot yet, but that's no reason to revert to manual cats until they do, either.
-:: If I missed any external link templates in the patterns list, please let me know. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:29, 12 April 2018 (CDT)
+: For Voxel Doom, if a screenshot is not so meaningful when "they look just like vanilla 2D if viewed straight", then how about making one from a angle (e.g. on the side of a monster that hasn't woken up yet, or of a rotating weapon)? And if that's too difficult, then maybe we need the wad template smarter (noshot=true parameter, similar to nocat=true in {{tl|map}} ?) instead of dismissing it. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:52, 20 June 2023 (CDT)
-== Level has serious issues with popular mod loaded - put in "bugs", "trivia" or not at all? ==
+:: Yeah, the option to remove the screenshot window would be a welcome addition. That would solve the problem and still allow the option to add one later. Always nice to have more options. I agree that the wad template should be used whenever possible. The only reason i didn't do it here is because i feel using in-game screenshot images in place of an official titlepic is undesirable, the screenshot window can't be removed and i saw [[Æons of Death|other]] [[WidePix|pages]] also didn't use one. But i now see the error in my ways. --[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 13:18, 20 June 2023 (CDT)
-Hey Xymph, I'm currently working on the walkthrough for {{maplinkgen|MAP17|Metastasize|Community Chest 4}}. While playing through the level, I found that mods where boxes of rockets could be shot and blown up (e.g. Brutal Doom v21 beta) caused serious problems in this level, as one would telefrag the box (as part of the level progression) and die in the explosion. Hence, I'm planning to add the following line in into the page:
+== Removing wikilinks for author of Voxel Doom ==
-"This level should not be played with mods that allow [[box of rockets|boxes of rockets]] to be shot and blown up as if they were [[barrel]]s (or where possible, have the setting turned off in the mod), as in the course of getting to each of the keys, the player will teleport onto a spot with a box of rockets already there. With such mods loaded, the player will [[telefrag]] the box of rockets and be hit by a point-blank explosion, which will likely kill them."
+I forgot to ask then, but why did you remove the wl for the name of the author, Cheello, from the [[Voxel Doom]] article and the [[Cacowards 2022]] page, and in fact all articles on the wiki? So far his only contribution is this one mod, but Voxel Doom II is slated for release in the coming months, and his work on Voxel Doom (plus the Cacoward) warrants a potential page, no? Just curious, because there are many red links for other author pages that seem to be just fine. --[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 10:40, 27 June 2023 (CDT)
-The question is - should this line go into "bugs", "trivia", or should it not be on the page at all? --[[User:15FiftySeven|15FiftySeven]] ([[User talk:15FiftySeven|talk]]) 09:51, 7 May 2018 (CDT)
+: You mean all ''three'' articles? :) We have [[Doom Wiki:Criteria for people articles|guidelines for people articles]] and the main criterium is to have done something notable, with most examples being plural. I don't follow mod plans and unreleased mods explicitly don't count anyway. Other criteria are gaming-related personal information and external resources (like a personal Doom page or a YT/Twitch channel). When none of that is available, like in this case (as far as I could find), then what would probably result is a one line/one work stub page. Does that help the wiki? I think not, we have plenty stub pages like that already, and it's very unlikely many will ever get enough content to be de-stubbed. See also the [[User talk:Nockson#Mapper_pages_with_few.2Fno_covered_works|related discussion about mappers]]. So I think we shouldn't automatically redlink people names as has happened often in the past and have occasionally unlinked others -- but I don't have time, inclination or enough insight to go a pruning spree through the entire wiki, nor is that the intention of the criteria. Thus the existence of other people redlinks, nor thin stub pages, shouldn't weigh in heavily as precedents. As stated in the criteria, "determinations must be made on a case-by-case basis in many instances." So if in the future, Cheello releases another notable work that is covered on the wiki, then sure, create an article. And ''that'' is when it is the right time to (blue)link a name everywhere -- not now, preemptively and prematurely, IMO. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:57, 27 June 2023 (CDT)
-:Personally I wouldn't put it there. I would mention the issue instead on the [[Brutal Doom]] article. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 12:03, 7 May 2018 (CDT)
-: The PWAD was designed for Boom-compatible ports, so when an unrelated mod has an unexpected gameplay effect, that's certainly not a map bug, and possibly not even something that needs to be mentioned on the PWAD page or the specific map page. Gez's suggestion works for me too. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:56, 7 May 2018 (CDT)
+:: Understood. Well, Cheello actually does have a [https://www.youtube.com/@cheello_art/videos YouTube channel], but i agree with the demand for multiple noteworthy releases. --[[User:Gregor|Gregor]] ([[User talk:Gregor|talk]]) 02:21, 28 June 2023 (CDT)
-==Shedding data from map articles?==
+== Heretic pre-release screenshots ==
-Please double-check the recent changes:
-* https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP04:_Water_control_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&curid=33083&diff=167921&oldid=167880
-* https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP11:_ffffabolous_secret_level_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&curid=33089&diff=167933&oldid=167887
-* https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP15:_NUKAGE_PROCESSING_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&curid=33093&diff=167941&oldid=167891
-* https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP18:_SUBBSE_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&curid=33096&diff=167944&oldid=167894
-* https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP19:_Trial_And_Error_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&diff=prev&oldid=167945
-* https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP02:_Twilight_of_the_Gods_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&diff=next&oldid=167878
-These are all tagged with the revision text "use secrets & map data from textmapStats.php" and have atypically large negative deltas. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 17:22, 18 June 2018 (CDT)
-: I expected that would trigger someone's curiosity. :) As you may remember, [[DMMPST]] does not support [[UDMF]]. [[Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013#Levels|DMP2013Z.wad]] mixes seven UDMF maps with traditional ones, and [[User:XymphBot#dmmpstBot.php|dmmpstBot.php]] is the easiest way to generate a series of new pages. So in loading the pwad on top of the iwad (doom2.wad) as DMMPST requires, and requesting e.g. MAP02 statistics, DMMPST actually returns the iwad's data because it ignores the pwad UDMF data. Compare [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP02:_Twilight_of_the_Gods_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&oldid=167676#Statistics MAP02:_Twilight_of_the_Gods_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)#Statistics] with [[MAP02:_Underhalls_(Doom_II)#Statistics]]. I could have manually created the six skeleton pages without the things data, but that would be a bit more cumbersome than just letting dmmpstBot.php rip and fixing the secret sectors and map data afterwards, and shedding the things tables.
+Hello! Once again I need your advice. In one of the issues of CD-only magazine "Interactive Entertainment" I found several screenshots of pre-release version of Heretic (this was discussed on {{dwforums|119534|Doomworld in 2021}}). I think they are important for the wiki. I've edited them a little: removed black bars and corrected aspect ratio. But the question is - can I upload them using standard HerHex license? Because I didn't actually take them - it was either Raven or someone from the magazine's staff. Is any additional license tag needed? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 13:00, 6 July 2023 (CDT)
-: Note that the page for the seventh map article already existed with a prior things table, and I left that one alone even though it's not styled entirely like DMMPST would do it. I assume Joe-ilya entered that correctly [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=MAP09:_Language_Barrier_(Doomworld_Mega_Project_2013)&oldid=126676#Things at the time].
+: Not a specialist in this subject matter, but the screenshot-herhex license covers "the design and artwork depicted in the screenshot" -- not who took the shot. And it seems to me that this applies to pre-release shots just as much as post-release ones. See also e.g. Quasar's article for [[Hexen: Beyond Heretic Screenshots (hexenscn)]]. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 17:02, 6 July 2023 (CDT)
-: I suppose the proper way out of this conundrum would be to make DMMPST handle UDMF, but that's pretty tough and &ndash; given the relatively low number of UDMF maps &ndash; may not be worth the effort. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 03:12, 19 June 2018 (CDT)
-:: OK thanks for the explanation. I just wanted to be sure something accidental didn't happen :) --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 03:38, 19 June 2018 (CDT)
+== Name change ==
-== Knee deep in KDiZD and Chocorenderlimits ==
+Hey Xymph, sorry to bug you again, I know I'm a PITA but I swear this will be the last one. As I have completed my de-transitioning, could I ask you to add my real name (Cristiano Montanari) to my article (thelokk)? I'd do it myself but I'm afraid of breaking links or stuff like that. Thanks!
+: Disclaimer: this is no comment on any kind of transition, that's a personal matter. But there was a [[Special:Diff/352071/352077|name addition]] 11 months ago, a [[User_talk:Gez#Real_name_removal|name removal]] 6 months ago, and now there should be a name addition again? Wtf? Each time this affects the wiki on [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=500&offset=0&ns0=1&ns1=1&ns2=1&ns3=1&ns4=1&ns5=1&ns6=1&ns7=1&ns8=1&ns9=1&ns10=1&ns11=1&ns12=1&ns13=1&ns14=1&ns15=1&ns2300=1&ns2301=1&ns2302=1&ns2303=1&search=thelokk dozens of pages] and it's the kind of double/triple work nobody likes. So for the wiki it would better to just stick to the alias. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 08:50, 14 July 2023 (CDT)
-I saw that you just fixed "Knee deep in KDiZD" into KDiZD in the Chocorenderlimits page. There is a project named [https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/42197-knee-deep-in-kdizd-whoring-out-screenshots-and-looking-for-mappers Knee deep in KDiZD] and [https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/42197-knee-deep-in-kdizd-whoring-out-screenshots-and-looking-for-mappers/?page=11&tab=comments#comment-726841 it seems more likely to be the one that first used Chocorenderlimts], given that it is a vanila project and all, while KDiZD is a ZDoom project. So, were you mistaking? Or did i miss something? --[[User:BuildCat|BuildCat]] ([[User talk:BuildCat|talk]]) 12:09, 27 June 2018 (CDT)
+== Thing counting on maps ==
-: I ran [https://www.doomworld.com/search/?q=%22Knee%20Deep%20In%20Knee%20Deep%20In%20ZDoom%22&sortby=relevancy some] [https://www.doomworld.com/search/?q=%22Knee%20Deep%20In%20KDIZD%22&sortby=relevancy searches] which came up empty, hence I concluded the red link was an oversight -- but with a nagging thought in the back of my mind that a forum regular might correct me. Thanks. ;) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:21, 27 June 2018 (CDT)
-==PSX maps==
+Hi, after looking at the table of things for Tribute Quilt, I discovered a few unfortunately placed difficulty flags that I'd like to fix and re-upload fixed version to idgames while it's not too late. Should I then fix the table manually, or ask you to run your bot again? --[[User:ViolentBeetle|ViolentBeetle]] ([[User talk:ViolentBeetle|talk]]) 16:53, 10 August 2023 (CDT)
-When you're around in IRC again, I'd like to send you the PSX maps, which I've converted to a vanilla-compatible format, for you to make map graphics for and run stats against - we can discuss adding support to DMMPST for thing tables etc. if you want as well - there are some special considerations with regards to how spectres work that would need handling, unless I change the extractor to modify the thing types of special spectres. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 14:18, 21 July 2018 (CDT)
+: When the second re-upload is moved into newstuff, I'll grab it and rerun the bot script. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:12, 11 August 2023 (CDT)
-: In passing, I'll note that SLADE 3 can generate map images from PSX Doom and Final Doom maps, but you first need to select the VERTEXES lump and type the console command "vertexpsx". --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 16:27, 21 July 2018 (CDT)
+== Freedoom Phase 2 music ==
-:: Cool; I wasn't sure that ever got implemented. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 16:53, 21 July 2018 (CDT)
-: If you could update your extractor to change the thing type of regular spectres back to 58 (dec) and of nightmare spectres to some unused type (3007?), then it would require very little additional support in DMMPST to generate correct thing tables for them. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:20, 22 July 2018 (CDT)
+Hi Frans, can you please help with cleaning up [[Freedoom:_Phase_2_music|this WIP page]] a little? e.g. adding a description like the other soundtrack pages? Thanks. [[User:Blursphere|Blursphere]] ([[User talk:Blursphere|talk]]) 16:49, 21 August 2023 (CDT)
+: Nope, no knowledge about, nor spare time for, that topic. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:51, 21 August 2023 (CDT)
-Looking at the new Club Doom map, I think that edit is best reverted. Map images typically prune the meaningless sectors (holding cells, control sectors, etc.) to focus on the actual map part, and the presence of a "signature area" in Club Doom far away from the playable area makes the map thumbnail totally unreadable. --[[User:Gez|Gez]] ([[User talk:Gez|talk]]) 08:16, 27 July 2018 (CDT)
+== Categorization ==
-: Not reverted but remedied the usual way. I included the area because it's described in Trivia, but this is fine too. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 09:23, 27 July 2018 (CDT)
-== Pre-1.9 map uploads ==
+Hi! Regarding [[Special:Diff/409839|this]] and [[Special:Diff/409840|this]] edits: I did it so the articles wouldn't get lost in a sea of source ports' names. Another way to fix this is to create a category called "Source ports by name". What do you think? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 13:17, 24 August 2023 (CDT)
+: With the sizable influx of port articles in the past year or two, I agree it's time for "Source ports by name", analog to subcat "PWADs by name". Then the related but non-primary topics don't need a sorting asterisk anymore. The ones currently still using an asterisk are fine though. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 13:52, 24 August 2023 (CDT)
+:: I've created the subcat. Should I manually move cats there or is there some way to automate this process? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 14:19, 24 August 2023 (CDT)
+::: Automation - we don't want to clutter RC with +/- 170 tiny edits, and I guess you're not too eager about such a monotonous job either. But I don't have a script ready for this particular task, so it'll take some coding/preparation. Patience. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:52, 24 August 2023 (CDT)
+:::: Great, thanks! I know you don't like RC clutter, that's why I asked. (I sometimes like to perform monotonous activities, they help to relax my brain a little.) --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 15:00, 24 August 2023 (CDT)
-Hi Xymph.&nbsp; Wow, the bot's lump parsing improves by the day, it seems.&nbsp; :D
+I think I weeded out the actual ports from the related articles. Main SP cat is now much more manageable indeed. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:23, 27 August 2023 (CDT)
+: Yes, it looks much better. Thank you! --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 12:31, 27 August 2023 (CDT)
-Please see e.g. [[:File:Doom v1.2 E3M9 map.png#File usage|here]]: "The following file is a duplicate of this file"&nbsp; &mdash;&nbsp;that means a pixel-for-pixel duplicate, so no fair use justification will ever be possible.&nbsp; Sorry.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 04:10, 28 July 2018 (CDT)
+== Article deletion ==
-: Sorry but I have no idea what "bot's lump parsing" refers to.
+Hello. I would like my DoomWiki article (https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Thelokk) to be deleted and protected from recreation. Thanks. {{unsigned|Thelokk}}
-: The pre-v1.9 map views are planned to be used in console map comparisons, because the console levels were based on those older versions. Quasar and I discussed this on IRC yesterday, and I simply uploaded the two whole batches for convenience and naming consistency. Then the comparisons can always use v1.2/v1.666 filenames, and I may write a bot script to do that (including creation of the transcluded gallery, if we get the tabs template working), so naming consistency would help there. If duplicate files are problematic, would it be possible to replace them with redirects to their v1.9 counterparts? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 05:08, 28 July 2018 (CDT)
+: I am sorry, but what is the reason for this? Besides the work needed to restructure so many articles to match this new reality, I hope you realize a wiki page is not a personal space, but a neutral catalogue of information that is useful for people to have when looking up WADs and such. --[[User:Dynamo128|Dynamo128]] ([[User talk:Dynamo128|talk]]) 14:29, 2 September 2023 (CDT)
+:: My bad, had an episode, disregard the above request. Will make sure it doesn't happen again. [[User:Thelokk|Thelokk]] ([[User talk:Thelokk|talk]]) 04:06, 6 September 2023 (CDT)
+::: On Sep 4, you had the [[idgames archive]] maintainers remove eight of your works from the archive. That is your right, but raises the question: why? You removed [[Special:Diff/411561|six of them]] from your wiki article... oookay. But yesterday, the other two were re-uploaded: 12ep.zip exactly the same as before, and boa2kd.zip with changes to the .wad but not the .txt. They ended up at the same paths in the archive, but because of the intermediate removals, received a new ids in the Doomworld interface, requiring [[Special:Diff/412281|another update]]. Updating releases should be done by simply uploading a new version, with an optional note to the maintainers, then they will keep the same id. And the identical 12ep.zip removal/re-upload was completely unnecessary.
+::: Nope, I don't think your "episode" ended. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 02:44, 8 September 2023 (CDT)
+:::: I took note of the same thing myself and was going to ask if there was any particular reason behind the deletions but ultimately decided against it. Either way, as far as the wiki is concerned, I'm willing to guess we generally want any person's body of work to be as complete as possible, including works that are no longer available for one reason or another. It is information after all, and a wiki's mission is generally to preserve as much of it as possible to my understanding. That said, Thelokk's choices are their own, and if they prefer to have parts of their history removed (as sad as it makes me that they would in the first place), I'm not one to stop them. --[[User:MF38|MF38]] ([[User talk:MF38|talk]]) 03:03, 8 September 2023 (CDT)
+::::: I agree about information preservation, but if there is no link left for a file, then there's little point in preserving only the file's name. Exception is of course when the work already has a wiki article. I checked DSDA but it didn't have those six files. I could have gone on a wider search or tried the Wayback Machine, but that didn't seem worth the trouble. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 03:46, 8 September 2023 (CDT)
-:: Based on [[File talk:Screenshot Doom 20180603 143620.png|this]] testing, I would say yes, replacing with redirects should work, provided nothing is written above the redirect command.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 06:53, 28 July 2018 (CDT)
+== Episode replacement ==
-==Ask and ye shall receive==
+Hello! I want to fix all inclusions of the word "episode" that are used for mods and not for IWADs. What do you think is the correct name for them: "episode replacement" or "episode replacement mod/WAD"? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 16:26, 11 September 2023 (CDT)
-https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/101943-doom-wiki-month-in-review-issue-4-late-edition/ --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 08:41, 14 August 2018 (CDT)
+: Replacement already indicates it's a mod, and the target paragraph already defines it as a "set of fan-made levels". So, the former suffices. Btw, replacing existing wikilinks to Megawad#Episode_replacement from before the redirect to the same, would not be a wise use of time. Only where episode is used where ep.replacement was meant, would be useful to update, as you did a few times already. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:47, 11 September 2023 (CDT)
-: Heh, nice. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 11:10, 14 August 2018 (CDT)
-== Template:Deleted ==
+== Heretic HUD Face ==
-Oh wow.  If I hadn’t seen it in print, I wouldn’t have believed it.  Thank you!  Ironically that happens *less* often in larger batches, because there isn’t all that thinking in between to distract me (but IMO each really has to be judged case by case as I said on DWF).  Glad someone was paying attention.  [[User:MuffinProvensen|MuffinProvensen]] ([[User talk:MuffinProvensen|talk]]) 12:47, 20 August 2018 (CDT)
-: I was just about to move this entry into chronological order myself, so... thanks. ;) Also, I had some difficulty understanding what this is about, coming from a little used account -- until I found you're RyanW. :) Still, is this about my adding the deleted template around those two Template:Code instances, or the further series I continued in your footsteps? What does "it" mean? Also, I don't follow DWF apart from a few specific topics, so what does that pointer refer to?
-: Really, I appreciate the enthusiastic response, but some of it is lacking sufficient context to follow. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 13:02, 20 August 2018 (CDT)
-:: Yes, you are all good.&nbsp; "Thank you" referred to both your corrections of me and the additional edits (though I am working from a disorganized offline list and probably would have found the latter eventually).&nbsp; Sorry for the confusion; I try not to put any credentials into my phone that I really care about.&nbsp; :D&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 17:07, 20 August 2018 (CDT)
-== Mapper articles ==
+Hi, I noticed that the HUD face used in Heretic's deathmatch mode looks quite similar to the player character's face in prior Raven release [[Shadowcaster]] (the resemblance is more clear if you resize Kurt's face to the dimensions of Heretic's HUD). Where should/would I put this information, and how? [[User:MargaretThatcher|MargaretThatcher]] ([[User talk:MargaretThatcher|talk]]) 15:30, 22 September 2023 (CDT)
+: Not familiar with this topic area. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:02, 22 September 2023 (CDT)
+: We have a [[status bar]] article, add it to the Heretic section there. --[[User:Dynamo128|Dynamo128]] ([[User talk:Dynamo128|talk]]) 16:20, 22 September 2023 (CDT)
+::Correction: The face actually appears in the intermission screen post-deathmatch. I don't know what page this would fit, though.[[User:MargaretThatcher|MargaretThatcher]] ([[User talk:MargaretThatcher|talk]]) 17:33, 22 September 2023 (CDT)
-So, we are creating articles for every mapper mentioned in Doom wiki through script now? It does lighten the load for people adding more info thanks to existing skeletons so thanks :) [[User:BuildCat|BuildCat]] ([[User talk:BuildCat|talk]]) 6:13, 11 September 2018 (CDT)
+== Possibly new glitch? ==
-: Not every perhaps, but yes, [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing#Script-generated mapper stubs|see here]]. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:19, 11 September 2018 (CDT)
-==Crazy idea==
+Was playing doom 3 Resurrection of Evil and a pretty goofy but also very intriguing glitch happened to me. I’m on an iPhone, is there any way to upload a video into here? . [[User:NewsReporter|NewsReporter]] ([[User talk:NewsReporter|talk]]) 16:02, 25 September 2023 (CDT)
-Why don't we make some of the marked maps a bit larger on the page when and where it won't disrupt article layout? I don't mean like 2x as big or anything so dramatic, but maybe just large enough that the markers don't require a magnifying glass to check out ;) Usual disclaimer about my poor eyesight applies, of course. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 11:58, 8 October 2018 (CDT)
+: No, and the wiki isn't the place for speculation about possible glitches anyway. You could start a topic on Doomworld, it might not be new either. But if it is and ''if'' it's worth documenting on the wiki, then the topic can be used as reference. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 16:25, 25 September 2023 (CDT)
-: That's fine for large maps, though in your example case (and with my eyesight) still not enough to distinguish spawn 18 from spawn 19. ;-) Feel free to apply it to the other two SVE maps as well. But I think it won't avoid the need to open the spawn map in another tab to really distinguish all points.
+== WADCAT full name ==
-: For [[Id_Map01#Analysis|more]] [[Hank's_Lair#Analysis|typically]] sized DM maps, the standard scaling should be adequate to discern the spawn numbers, or are you proposing to increase their scaling too? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:57, 8 October 2018 (CDT)
-:: True regarding the numbers, but, for me at least, I can more easily tell the blue team spawns from the green DM spots with the size increase. The other examples you give look good already to me. --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 14:18, 8 October 2018 (CDT)
+Hello! Could you please comment [[Talk:WAD Concatenator|'''here''']] because you renamed that page using a supposedly incorrect name. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 16:10, 1 October 2023 (CDT)
-== "PWAD top-5" statistics ==
+== Pyroscourge/Pieruskwurje ==
-Hahaha, Fredrik would be proud [https://doomwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Doom_Wiki:Policies_and_guidelines&oldid=6263#Things_that_may_have_articles].&nbsp; This is exactly the sort of enhancement which only a bot can make &mdash; even if we imagined that we could have a strict rule about double-checking every new map article, people would forget to do so.
+Hello! I've updated Pyroscourge alias (see [https://www.doomworld.com/forum/post/2719587 this post]). Is there a way to automate the process of changing their category in all the map pages too or should I do it manually? Also, {{deleted|[[:Category:StarScream levels|this category]]}} should be merged with theirs. Can you please explain how to properly do that? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 06:11, 19 October 2023 (CDT)
+: All done. I don't think it is really necessary to update the alias in the intros of map pages or the WAD articles though - that is how those releases were published at the time. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:24, 19 October 2023 (CDT)
+:: Thank you! --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 06:28, 19 October 2023 (CDT)
-One small suggestion: include a date stamp, like the speedrun tables have?&nbsp; That would protect against any future change which created lag between updates (e.g. MediaWiki upgrade disabling Wikimate indefinitely, or more optimistically, an increase in active editors who insist on documenting each megawad on day zero).&nbsp; Hope that makes sense, thanks.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 09:05, 21 December 2018 (CST)
+== Code tags ==
-: Sure, done. Actually, it's not even a bot script, just a Bash script that greps/sorts through results from earlier DMMPST runs, bot-wise and manually. :) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 11:06, 21 December 2018 (CST)
+Hey, I've got a small question: should I replace all instances of html ''code'' tags with the ''c'' template? I saw you did this to ''tt'' tags (and remembered it as the right thing to do), but I'm not sure about the ''code'' because it looks different - it has some sort of frame which the ''c'' template lacks. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 12:49, 9 November 2023 (CST)
+: There's a [[Doom Wiki:Policies and guidelines#Syntax|guideline about those]]. Inline {{c|&lt;code&gt;}} tags are still used in special situations like [[A_Chase|code pointers]] and alike, but normally the 'c' template should be used. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 13:13, 9 November 2023 (CST)
+:: Ah, thanks! Just fixed it [[Ouch face|here]]. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 13:17, 9 November 2023 (CST)
+::: That falls under "alike" situations, I'd say. And in [[Skill_level#Doom_3_skill_levels|cases]] [[MAP07:_Showdown_(Alien_Vendetta)#Description|like]] a command-line parameter with an argument, it also visually helps to group them together. I suppose there's a grey area here... --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 13:31, 9 November 2023 (CST)
-: For your Fredrik reference, I assumed you specifically meant [[Special:Diff/20/37|this change]], and interpreted vanilla maps as stock levels (doing stats for all vanilla maps covered on the wiki seems rather pointless, and then, why not for maps requiring a source port?). So this is now [[List of stock level statistics‎|completed]]. :) --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 07:09, 26 December 2018 (CST)
+== Unreviewed redirects ==
-== [[Special:Diff/203797|MAYhem mayhem]] ==
+Hello! I see a lot of old valid redirects in [[Special:UnreviewedPages]]. I've just checked two of them - [[Icon of Sin]] and [[Icon Of Sin]]. Is it right? Should I proceed? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 11:02, 21 November 2023 (CST)
-I had no idea that map was renamed. I used to take the names from the MAPINFO lump and I've got a copy of "mayhem2048.wad" where it's still called ''Sheltered Outpost''. It's great when beta releases aren't marked as such. --[[User:Eris Falling|Eris Falling]] ([[User talk:Eris Falling|talk]]) 08:17, 6 August 2019 (CDT)
+: I started on those yesterday already (and wrote a script against the database to assist and did [[Special:Log/delete|speedy deletes]] of meaningless/unused ones), so thanks for asking but let's not both go in there. Also, capitalizing any wiki link/redirect is unnecessary since MediaWiki already capitalizes the resulting HTML link. Instead, perhaps you can add PUSS28 to all participating mappers? --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 11:10, 21 November 2023 (CST)
-: And I wasn't aware that the overview page had been created from a (unidentified) beta. Thanks for the clarification. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 10:28, 6 August 2019 (CDT)
+:: Got it! Will do PUSS then. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 11:17, 21 November 2023 (CST)
-== gamers.org URLs ==
+All done. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 15:55, 24 November 2023 (CST)
+: I can't help but ask again, because I see that you've created several "missing" redirects, is there a need to create redirects for Final Doom in the format "Level XX"? (see section "Two questions about redirects" above, from June of this year) --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 16:03, 24 November 2023 (CST)
+:: Back in 2008-2009, TheGreenHerring went to some length to create shortcut redirects sans PWAD name, but in a megawad series sometimes forgot one or several. I merely completed those series for consistency, but didn't even bother with Hell Revealed II which goes only up to MAP10. For Final Doom, only Plutonia MAP30 and MAP32 have 'Level xx' redirects, and the MAP30 ones aren't even properly capitalized. None are used anywhere, so I'm more inclined to remove those, and leave only the MAP32 ones since that's probably Final Doom's most renowned/notorious level. Beyond that, my answer remains the same, I don't see the point in expanding the old terminology. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 11:16, 25 November 2023 (CST)
+::: For what it's worth, I agree with Xymph here, especially considering that currently, in virtually every section of the community, the terminology of "MAPXX" is absolutely widespread and widely understood in a way that it may not have been in the past where terms like Level 01 may have been more liberally used in such contexts. I think Level XX redirects are wholly anachronistic as a result, and not needed. --[[User:Dynamo128|Dynamo128]] ([[User talk:Dynamo128|talk]]) 11:21, 25 November 2023 (CST)
+:::: Thank you both for your answers! Consider this case closed. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 11:32, 25 November 2023 (CST)
-Sorry about that.&nbsp; This is another case where the age of my environment impedes me from seeing every situational detail (like the [[Special:Diff/210435/210445|security certificates]]).&nbsp; Sometimes a browser cruises right past warning dialogs.&nbsp; :>
+== Trouble with redirects' anchors ==
-That said, I just noticed you *did* clarify the situation for users like me: ''"You can also use a Browser and use HTTP (Hyper Text Transfer Protocol), which is what is used by the links below."'' [http://gamers.org/ftp/]&nbsp; Clearly not the same as the /idstuff links I replaced.&nbsp; So I'll remember that for future cases where Doomworld or 3ddownloads is missing items (which again I assume are ultimately the Doomworld staff's purview).&nbsp; Thanks for double-checking.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 12:06, 31 January 2020 (CST)
+Hello! I want to make redirects for all [[Heretic cheat codes]] and link them to the table in the article, similar to Doom codes. However, redirects with anchors (in preview mode) for some reason continue to point to the beginning of the article, and not to the corresponding row inside the table (that is, when I open a link from a preview of the redirect). I suspected the problem was with the c template, so I removed them, but nothing changed. Do you know what can cause this? Am I doing something wrong? --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 14:34, 2 December 2023 (CST)
+: Add span id's like in [[Doom cheat codes]]. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:38, 2 December 2023 (CST)
+:: Thanks! It's nice to learn something new. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 14:56, 2 December 2023 (CST)
-== Source modification ==
+== Notability, self-promotion and redlinks ==
-Hi Xymph,
-I just saw your edit on [[source modification]] - ''External links: sort first in its own cat)''
-Looking at the change and reading your message, i'd need some additional clarity. What has to be done extra?
+In the interest of getting some clarification to the ongoing discussions about notability and self-promotion, how do you feel about WAD authors creating pages for their own works if they've already been redlinked? I'm mostly asking this in relation to the [[Special:WhatLinksHere/Gomorrah|redlinks for Gomorrah]], which I've been contemplating creating a page for but refraining from out of respect for the rules against self-promotion. Would you see it as such if I were the one to create the page, given that I'm the wad's author? And more importantly, do you deem Gomorrah notable enough to warrant a wiki page in the first place? --[[User:MF38|MF38]] ([[User talk:MF38|talk]]) 04:50, 3 January 2024 (CST)
+: Thanks for asking. It was Dynamo who [[Special:Diff/340685|redlinked]] it and the release topic looks favorable, so it seems notable indeed. Thus I think you creating the article is no problem. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 05:10, 3 January 2024 (CST)
+:: Alright, thanks for the swift response! --[[User:MF38|MF38]] ([[User talk:MF38|talk]]) 05:43, 3 January 2024 (CST)
-To put in advance: I did see that its quite redundant to have the article source modification when the header already says that the main article is in fact, source modification. But that's just as far as i got with it. Thanks in advance. -- [[User:Redneckerz|Redneckerz]] ([[User talk:Redneckerz|talk]]) 18:41, 27 April 2020 (CET)
+== Sorry! ==
-:Nothing more has to be done: {{cat|Ammo|it is}} {{cat|Weapons|convention}} to sort the main article (correctly referenced via {{tl|catmore}}) for a category first in that category. My edit accomplished that, that's all.
+Apologies for editing the [[Bonus level]] page "live" while you were constantly approving my edits. I should probably learn how to use my userspace as a sandbox before properly publishing edits. [[User:Individualised|Individualised]] ([[User talk:Individualised|talk]]) 06:01, 23 February 2024 (CST)
-:I don't see anything particularly redundant, so not sure what you're referring to above. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 12:23, 27 April 2020 (CDT)
+: Not necessarily, but please use the Show Preview and Show Changes buttons to carefully and repeatedly check your edits before submitting them. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 06:03, 23 February 2024 (CST)
-:: Oh. Well, you see, the attached text made it sound like an task that had to be done (''Sort first in its own cat)'' so that got me confused. Good to hear it was a nothingburger, then! Thanks Xymph for clarification. -- [[User:Redneckerz|Redneckerz]] ([[User talk:Redneckerz|talk]]) 21:08, 27 April 2020 (CET)
-:::That happened [[Special:Diff/218835|elsewhere today too]], but edit summaries normally describe what the edit accomplishes, not what another editor should do. ;-) For such discussions there are talk pages. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 14:16, 27 April 2020 (CDT)
+== Mapper stub ==
-::::Somewhere i knew and it just did not register haha ;) Nevertheless thank you for all your hard work done here and its beeing a great learning school for me. -- [[User:Redneckerz|Redneckerz]] ([[User talk:Redneckerz|talk]]) 21:27, 27 April 2020 (CET)
-== Interwiki table ==
+Sorry for poking but, since I can't find the relevant info, what does it take exactly to remove the 'stub' status from a mapper's page? personal trivia? info on projects outside of Doom? a certain number of external links? Thanks in advance [[Special:Contributions/109.54.167.114|109.54.167.114]] 20:32, 11 April 2024 (CDT)
+: An intro of one generic sentence, which most mapper pages start with (from [[User:XymphBot#createMapper.php|this script]]), is stubby. Once there is more meat on that bone, or indeed other parts of the article besides the main body of work, it no longer is stubby, I guess. There is no strong guideline, but it follows from the [[Doom_Wiki:Policies_and_guidelines#Things_that_may_have_articles|policy]] and [[Doom_Wiki:FAQ#Why_is_there_a_.22cleanup.22_or_.22stub.22_banner_at_the_top_of_the_page_I_created.3F|FAQ]] that incomplete articles are tagged 'stub'. Once it's complete "enough" the template can be removed, although that is subjective to page and person. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 04:56, 12 April 2024 (CDT)
-Hi Xymph.&nbsp; This doesn't impact your edits, which look good, but see [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T187630 here] and [[Doom Wiki:Central Processing/2014#Misuse of Interwiki extension|here]].&nbsp; It isn't case sensitive.&nbsp; The interwiki extension simply does not backfill links when a prefix is added, like Whatlinkshere or Linksearch would, necessitating an edit to each page.&nbsp; (And since it's more difficult to identify affected pages, Quasar was probably right to be irritated when I removed those entries.)&nbsp; HTH.&nbsp; [[User talk:Ryan W|Ryan W]] ''([[User:Ryan W|living fossil]])'' 07:23, 5 May 2020 (CDT)
+== Doom Power ==
-: Oh, ok. Thanks for the clarification. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 07:32, 5 May 2020 (CDT)
-==Crazy idea==
+Hi! There are a few issues with dp template. First, it is called forum, not forums, just check the upper central part of its main page (in mobile view at least). Second and most important - the forum is sometimes purged and archived, which will imo F up all of the links. Archives are stored [http://arc.iddqd.ru/ here]. --[[User:Nockson|Nockson]] ([[User talk:Nockson|talk]]) 06:28, 15 April 2024 (CDT)
-I might could code a selector and cookie storage for the table color scheme you're experimenting with so that users could choose one that looks good to them. This is particularly sensible for accessibility reasons (ie, various forms of colorblindness may make a good looking default in our opinion hard to parse for other people). --[[User:Quasar|Quasar]] ([[User talk:Quasar|talk]]) 07:08, 12 July 2020 (CDT)
+: In English, I thought a forums system (like phpBB) is referred to in plural, but google search results indicate that opinions vary, and it can also be called a forum (with sub-forums). So either way is fine with me. I am aware of their (self-inflicted) archive problem, and added support now. --[[User:Xymph|Xymph]] ([[User talk:Xymph|talk]]) 07:18, 15 April 2024 (CDT)

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