Talk:Doom + Doom II
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Code Lineage[edit]
Heretic + Hexen was added to the code lineage thing by another user as being "quite obviously" based on this. For the record, the dev interview on Nightdive Studio's YouTube account titled "Xaser Acheron on the re-release of Heretic + Hexen | Deep Dive" has an explicit confirmation the Heretic + Hexen code is based on Doom + Doom II (its in the section starting at 24:09). --Nanashi (talk) 16:25, 8 August 2025 (CDT)
- But at the same time, the new stuff like EXDEFS aren't part of the ID24 specification. In fact, EXDEFS is only there to make the new stuff work, so its not part of any spec right now. If Doom + Doom II is KEX + ID24, then Heretic + Hexen is KEX + EXDEFS. The latter, tech wise, being more of a sidestep than a major revision. --Redneckerz (talk) 05:59, 9 August 2025 (CDT)
- That's not especially relevant to lineage discussions. We're not saying that H+H is a superset of D+D2, just that the project was built upon the previous project. The ID24 stuff was largely just enhancements to existing Doom standard, building upon Boom, MBF, MBF21, and offering new Doom-specific monsters and props. None of that was relevant to the Heretic and Hexen games, so it got tossed out. --Gez (talk) 06:21, 9 August 2025 (CDT)
- In addition: I know you just edited the EXDEFS page saying it reminds you more of DED, but the whole JSON-dehacked thing was from Xaser itself. Now, obviously fatique set in, so i am going with your definition. And yes, agreed on the terminology, but i prefer a separation because although it is built upon D + D2, none should expect ID24 in here. --Redneckerz (talk) 06:29, 9 August 2025 (CDT)
- Heretic was derived from Doom, and yet it does not have a BFG. It's like, with Bethesda games, you had this thing where the engine from Oblivion evolved into that of Fallout 3, which then evolved into that of Skyrim, which then evolved into that of Fallout 4, ping-ponging between the two franchises, but nobody expects Fallout 4 to load Oblivion mods. So I just don't see the problem. --Gez (talk) 07:01, 9 August 2025 (CDT)
- In addition: I know you just edited the EXDEFS page saying it reminds you more of DED, but the whole JSON-dehacked thing was from Xaser itself. Now, obviously fatique set in, so i am going with your definition. And yes, agreed on the terminology, but i prefer a separation because although it is built upon D + D2, none should expect ID24 in here. --Redneckerz (talk) 06:29, 9 August 2025 (CDT)
- That's not especially relevant to lineage discussions. We're not saying that H+H is a superset of D+D2, just that the project was built upon the previous project. The ID24 stuff was largely just enhancements to existing Doom standard, building upon Boom, MBF, MBF21, and offering new Doom-specific monsters and props. None of that was relevant to the Heretic and Hexen games, so it got tossed out. --Gez (talk) 06:21, 9 August 2025 (CDT)
