Talk:ZPack - Random Maps for ZDoom
With due respect to the designers, all of whom probably work harder on each map than I ever have on the wiki... does anyone else find it strange that we don't have separate episode articles for The Lost Episodes, a commercial release, but we do have them for this WAD, which is just another ZDoom entry in /idgames? Ryan W 18:28, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
- Yeah, now that I think of it, I find this odd, myself. In fact, now that I have the Requiem pages done, I thought about making pages for the Lost Episodes. I don't have the book, so I can't provide any story-related content from it, but I can certainly provide the usual gameplay information (or at least the secrets. ;) Failing that, I also considered doing pages for either Community Chest 3 (oh, the hubris!) or Mars War, but I digress. Either way, though, the contrast is certainly quite strange. The Green Herring 00:45, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
- Just my explanation of my thinking when I wrote the first draft of the articles. I was going off of this statement regarding WADs in the policies and guidelines on notability: "One article per map, plus one summary page for each multi-level file (as with the episodes of the classic series)." To me, this statement is ambiguous. It says multi-level file as if referring to separate wads but then episodes of the classic series which are absolutely not individual files. So, I made a guess, assuming that at the worst if other wiki editors did not like it they would merge things together. So that all is up to the regular editors of the wiki to decide.
- As far as my personal opinion goes, I don't see a real problem with letting wads which have arguably separate episodes (like ZPack, with 3 sets of 10 maps, definitely has unique episodes) have separate episode articles. Maybe some certain criteria, like how I put (ZPack) in the article titles for all the episodes, needs to be met, but that's about it. 188.8.131.52 22:00, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
- I think you're right about that statement being ambiguous. It was probably written before we had good examples of "summary" pages for third-party releases (they either had a list of levels and little else, or huge sections about plot and authors with no links to maps).
- Rereading my comment above, I made it sound like I wanted to merge the ZPack episode articles into the main article, but that's not the case — I can see merit in both approaches. For example, IMHO, Knee-Deep in the Dead has evolved into a fairly solid and self-consistent summary of things pertaining to that episode and only to that episode. On the other hand, 99 percent of PWAD articles are so short (because they don't really have storylines and their development wasn't discussed with the general public) that three episodes could easily be merged without creating an unwieldy article. In that case I would suggest an exception for commercial releases, splitting the actual lists of levels into a subsidiary article, because the introductory discussion and context is so long (similar to what Wikipedia does, or did do before the subsidiary article was deleted for non-notability).
- At this point, the whole issue may be a minor one, because few high-profile WADs actually use the Doom 1 episode structure. However, if we are really going to give every PWAD an article, then we should also ask how such a guideline would apply to WADs whose episodes are defined by scripted events, or even by text screens alone. Ryan W 22:27, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
- Well, what to do going forward basically goes beyond me as I'm not, nor do I plan to be, a long term contributor. I just wanted to get what I knew about ZPack down since I was having a really slow night (with just an oh so tiny hint of insomnia). Guidelines and standards are good and all that, so go right on ahead and figure that out whenever.
- I guess I might do some articles on the ZPack levels too, if I had that tool that makes the PNGs of the map layout. 184.108.40.206 23:55, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
- Heh, fair enough.
- Just a note: it's not a sin to create a map article that you know is incomplete. It just looks that way because TheGreenHerring has to add so many things to meet his own standards for a stub. :>
- You can download the map layout tool here. Of course, if you're like 99.7% of the human population and don't know anything about scripting languages, you might find Python intimidating (I do and I still think it is). That's okay. Write what you have time to write, and eventually someone else will read it and try to make it better. Ryan W 00:26, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
Custom things mapping
Decently documented DECORATE lumps in the main resource file ZDCC_RES.WAD as well as individual level WADs allowed me to compile the following custom things mapping file for DMMPST (TSV format):
# class thingID wikiname wikilink 0 3120 Afrit Monster Resource WAD#Monsters 0 30100 Bloodfiend 0 3333 Bruiser Demon Bruiser Demon (Beastiary) 0 29123 Catharsi 0 30128 Cybruiser 0 30112 Diabloist 0 30115 Death Incarnate 0 30116 Hades Sphere 0 29999 Infernal Spider 0 3205 Lord of Heresy Monster Resource WAD#Monsters 0 30101 Lurker 0 19999 Mini-spider 0 3205 Plasma Zombie Monster Resource WAD#Zombies 0 3126 Rocket Zombie Monster Resource WAD#Zombies 0 3109 Satyr Monster Resource WAD#Monsters 0 3126 Shadow 0 3117 Soul Harvester Monster Resource WAD#Monsters 0 30110 Spider-Demolisher 0 22099 Suicide Bomber 0 30666 Terminator 0 16555 Evil super shotgun marine zdoom:Classes:MarineSSG 0 16556 Evil plasma gun marine zdoom:Classes:MarinePlasma 0 30667 T667 Two zombie 0 30668 T667 Two zombie 0 30669 T667 Two zombie 7 6002 Data log 7 8666 Orakel 7 13579 Teleporter battery
Trying to puzzle out the soundtrack for this. First, music credits from the text file:
- Albino_Rhino aka farlowj
- 3D Realms, Duke Nukem 3D
- Attic Entertainment, Realms of Arkania
- Banshee, Painkiller
- Epic Megagames, UT2003
- John Romero, Unreleased Doom Music
- Mark Garnet
- Monolith, Blood
- Parralax Software, Descent
- Russel Pearson, World Carnage Champ.
- Sam Wolff & Dave Phaneuf
- Simon "SlayeR" Judd
- Sivak Drac
- Square, Final Fantasy
This list however is incomplete. Then metadata for songs.
- E1M1 (M_CPTT01.wad): lump name STLTHFRG ("stealth frag"?), Ogg Vorbis format, no useful metadata
- E1M2 (M_PHOBUS3.wad): lump name D_PHBS3, MIDI format, metadata: Star Fox / The Planet Fortuna / By: Sivak Drac
- E1M3 (M_VTMAP.wad): lump name D_VTMAP, MIDI format, metadata: Copyright © 2001 by Glacius
- E1M4 (M_SOLOUWSF.WAD): lump name D_SOLOBT, MIDI format, metadata: Quick MUS->MID ! for WinTex, "Between Levels" with some instruments changed
- E1M5 (M_SITEX.WAD): lump name D_SITEX, MP3 format, metadata: E1M1 / Classic Doom 3 / Sonic Clang / 2005
- E1M6 (M_ICYGLACY.WAD): lump name D_ICY2X, MUS format, no metadata at all (MUS format).
- E1M7 (M_TNICK.WAD): lump name D_TNICK, MIDI format, metadata: Future Military Conquests / by Lee Jackson / Copyright (c) 1996 Lee Jackson
- E1M8 (M_VAD02+03.wad): lump name D_VAD02, MIDI format, metadata shows conversion from MUS. "Grand Design" by Simon Judd.
- E1M9 (M_VAD02+03.wad): lump name D_VAD03 and D_VAD03B, MIDI format both. First metadata: (c) 1999 Marc A. Pullen. Second metadata: Death Wind (Climax Remix) / By Jay Reichard (firstname.lastname@example.org) / Original Melody- Death Wind / From F-Zero
- E1M0 (M_VAD04.wad): lump name D_VAD04, MUS format, "Bye Bye American Pie".
- E2M1 (M_PHOBUS.WAD): lump name D_PHOBUS, MIDI format, metadata: By Dave Phaneuf & Sam Wolf, Generated by NoteWorthy Composer
- E2M2 (M_INSANE.WAD): lump names D_INSANE and D_INSAN2, MIDI format both, no useful metadata either. First is Venus Atmospheric Lab theme, second is Neptune Storage Depot theme, both from Descent.
- E2M3 (M_T667TWO.WAD): lump name D_T667TW, MIDI format, metadata: Baked Goods / by Lee Jackson / Copyright (c) 1996 Lee Jackson
- E2M4 (M_ICY666.WAD): lump name D_ICY666, MUS format, no metadata at all (MUS format). Sounds like a remix of "Bye Bye American Pie" or its inspiration "Them Bones" by Alice in Chains
- E2M5 (M_FANBOY.WAD): lump name D_FANBOY, MIDI format, no useful metadata (just some NoteWorthy Composer default strings; I don't think "Symphony Template" is the actual title of this piece)
- E2M6 (M_TECU.wad): lump name D_TECU, MOD module format, metadata: culturebag / (c) by virgill '97 (source)
- E2M7 (M_T667.WAD): lump name D_T667, MIDI format, metadata: (C) Copyright © 1996 by Michael (CBLOOD10.MID from Blood)
- E2M8 (M_ICYTNT.wad): lump name D_ICYTNT, MP3 format, no useful metadata (ID3v2 tag containing only "eng")
- E2M9 (M_T667BOSS.WAD): lump names D_TBOSS1 and D_TBOSS2, MIDI format both. The first reminds me of Shadowcaster music (starts like g_temple.xmi, but differs after), perhaps same composer (Marc Schaefgen); metadata shows it was converted from XMI so it does most likely come from a game. No useful metadata for the second.
- E2M0 (M_PHOBUS2.WAD): lump name D_PHBS2 and D_PHBS2B, MIDI format both, metadata for the first: StarFox - Titania Stage -Mark Jansen- , metadata for the second: StarFox - Titania Boss -Mark Jansen-
- E3M1 (M_SAW02.wad): lump name D_SAW02, MOD module format, metadata: (C) Terminal Reality
- E3M2 (M_KEKS01.wad): lump name D_E2M8, MUS format, "Nobody Told Me About id"
- E3M3 (M_STEREO.WAD): lump name D_STEREO, MIDI format, metadata: Battle of the Gods
- E3M4 (M_ICYTUX.WAD): lump name D_ICYTUX, MIDI format, metadata: Alice In Chains -- Facelift -- "We Die Young"
- E3M5 (M_SOLOTSU.wad): lump names D_HN7TSU and D_77ESPR, MIDI format both, metadata first: Iifa Tree / Nobuo Uematsu - tracked by Jeff Copperthite , metadata second: Esper Battle / By Hitoshi Sakimoto
- E3M6 (M_13THHOUR.wad): lump name CHAOS_X, IT module format, metadata: "Chaos Theory" | "(c) Masters of Insanity" (which means Xaser AFAIK)
- E3M7 (M_VAD01.wad): lump name D_VAD01, MIDI format, metadata shows it's been converted from MUS. "The Depths" by Simon Judd.
- E3M8 (M_SAW01.WAD): lump name D_SAW01, metadata: Castlevania: Portrait of Ruin - Crucifix Held Close by Jayster / Sequenced by Jayster / Composed by Michiru Yamane & Yuzo Koshiro
- E3M9 (M_ICYMINI.wad): lump name D_ICYMNI, MUS format, "Sign of Evil"
- E3M0 (M_XASECT.wad): lump names D_XASECT, D_XAKLAY, and D_XABELL, MIDI format all. No useful metadata in first and third. Metadata for second: Copyright © 2004 by fatal. First is main theme from Hocus Pocus, second is Klaymen's theme from The Neverhood, third is probably an original composition by Xaser.
- TITLEMAP and misc (TITLEMAP.wad): lump names D_DM2TTL, D_DM2INT, and D_BUNNY, MIDI format first two, no useful metadata in either (instrument list for first, "WinJammer Demo" for second). Last is MUS format, "The End of DOOM".